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General Tabletop Discussion
*TTRPGs General
Realistic Consequences vs Gameplay
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<blockquote data-quote="billd91" data-source="post: 8004799" data-attributes="member: 3400"><p>Isn't that kind of up to them? Presumably, they entered into some kind of negotiation with the burgomaster for a reason. For the scene in question, achieving the result they wanted from the burgomaster would be their current job.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Depends on what they're negotiating for. They have a pretty broad set of choices in front of them that <strong>don't</strong> involve 1) insulting him, 2) trying to take him hostage - either of which should have had fairly predictable negative results (particularly the second).</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Since the OP made no implication that the PC would be dead with no further chance for action declaration - that's pretty much a non-starter as an argument. But of course a player could choose to play a PC who throws the tyrant's offer back in his face scornfully - but should he not expect to suffer the predictable consequences? Or should those consequences be unrelated to the established nature of the tyrant or not based on the scornful rejection? If they are, then what's the point of knowing anything or even trying to make rational choices?</p><p>Of course, a player could choose to play their PCs in a non-scornful manner or at least intelligent enough to swallow the scorn and turn down the tyrant's offer in a more deferential manner and then take his frustrations out on something else later once the negotiations have been peacefully completed, even if not successfully.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>In most cases, I would figure it's a mixture - there will be puzzles such as how to topple/defeat Strahd (at least in the short term), there will be chances to express the PC's personality, and there will be times when making an ill-considered choice should have negative consequences.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Sure, but another aspect of D&D is the possibility of skilled play - and that sometimes means the players making choices that indicate their PC's actually understand the world around them and experience it as though it were real to them with real cause and effect and consequences for the things they do.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>That's really a pointlessly pedantic nitpick since you knew exactly what I meant.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I don't assume it's a question of inferring what the DM is thinking. A meaningful choice is one that is taken with a reasonable understanding of the expected consequences - consequences that will be distinct from the ones you'd face if you made a significantly different choice. If the outcome isn't related to the choice being made, like the thin-skinned tyrant just laughing it off when insulted or the guards were too drunk to make an arrest, what kind of meaning would it have? None, it's just a thing that happened, and not really a result of a player's choice.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="billd91, post: 8004799, member: 3400"] Isn't that kind of up to them? Presumably, they entered into some kind of negotiation with the burgomaster for a reason. For the scene in question, achieving the result they wanted from the burgomaster would be their current job. Depends on what they're negotiating for. They have a pretty broad set of choices in front of them that [b]don't[/b] involve 1) insulting him, 2) trying to take him hostage - either of which should have had fairly predictable negative results (particularly the second). Since the OP made no implication that the PC would be dead with no further chance for action declaration - that's pretty much a non-starter as an argument. But of course a player could choose to play a PC who throws the tyrant's offer back in his face scornfully - but should he not expect to suffer the predictable consequences? Or should those consequences be unrelated to the established nature of the tyrant or not based on the scornful rejection? If they are, then what's the point of knowing anything or even trying to make rational choices? Of course, a player could choose to play their PCs in a non-scornful manner or at least intelligent enough to swallow the scorn and turn down the tyrant's offer in a more deferential manner and then take his frustrations out on something else later once the negotiations have been peacefully completed, even if not successfully. In most cases, I would figure it's a mixture - there will be puzzles such as how to topple/defeat Strahd (at least in the short term), there will be chances to express the PC's personality, and there will be times when making an ill-considered choice should have negative consequences. Sure, but another aspect of D&D is the possibility of skilled play - and that sometimes means the players making choices that indicate their PC's actually understand the world around them and experience it as though it were real to them with real cause and effect and consequences for the things they do. That's really a pointlessly pedantic nitpick since you knew exactly what I meant. I don't assume it's a question of inferring what the DM is thinking. A meaningful choice is one that is taken with a reasonable understanding of the expected consequences - consequences that will be distinct from the ones you'd face if you made a significantly different choice. If the outcome isn't related to the choice being made, like the thin-skinned tyrant just laughing it off when insulted or the guards were too drunk to make an arrest, what kind of meaning would it have? None, it's just a thing that happened, and not really a result of a player's choice. [/QUOTE]
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