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Message: <blockquote data-quote="pemerton" data-source="post: 8014234" data-attributes="member: 42582">This made me reflect on some of my experiences as player and GM.I don't play (as opposed to GM) very often, but I thought about my holy warrior in Burning Wheel who (as a result of a GM narration) discovered old letters in the abandoned tower of Evard (an evil sorcerer) that implied that my mother (an important relationsip called out on my PC sheet) was Evard's daughter - making him my grandfather. That was very challenging. I (which is to say my PC) burned them in the campfire (my character has an instinct When camping, always ensure that the campfire is burning).As a GM my NPCs are not always that deep. By default they are foils for the PC's actions. So whereas it is easy for me to point to changes in my gameworld that refect what has happened in play, I would say that NPCs are not always at the forefront of that. But I can think of examples. In my 4e game the one I rememer best is the Baron of Threshold, who went from being unsure of the PCs, to their ally and supporter, to a broken man after they revealed his niece to be a necromancer and killed her. In our Prince Valiant game a lot of the NPC changes are drawn in rather broad strokes - eg Saxons and Huns who convert and join the PCs' order - but there have been more nuanced examples, including some of the romantic relationships.A challenge in RPGing (at least for me) is bringing out the inner lives of characters, which can be demanding and generate a degree of self-consciousness when we're talking about low-key fiction among amateur authors/performers.This was interesting. I guess there are always opposing forces in the most basic sense that we can't all get what we want when we want different things.I think the structure of action declaration and resolution - both formal and informal - plays a big role here. Eg in a system like Burning Wheel it is made overt that the GM doesn't just have the job of deciding what s/he would like to happen. The GM has to decide if things go wrong for this character, what will that look like? So the game's procedures and structure force us to confront these opposing visions of how the fiction will unfold, and then dice to see which one prevails.I tend to run other systems in a similar way to this - to the extent that they permit - but few are as demanding as BW. But thinking, say, about Classic Traveller: it doesn't involve character in anything like the way that BW or even Prince Valilant does, but it still forces the GM to make those sorts of decisions. Eg if a player has his/her PC attempt any non-basic manoeuvre while wearing a vacc suit the rules call for a check, and if it fails the GM has to narrate the threatening situation that has arisen. And when a player has his/her PC talk to a NPC, the reaction dice have to be rolled (at our table the player rolls this like a check in D&D) and if the roll is poor the GM has to narrate the way in which the NPC is opposed to or hostile to the PC.And if it goes the other way - the player makes the vacc suit check or rolls a good reaction check or whatever - the GM has to honour that. The PC is not in danger from suit tearing or deoxygentation or whatever. The NPC takes a shine to the PC and will help him/her. Etc.I think walled off gardens would make RPGing very hard. I don't quite see how anything would really happen in the game.</blockquote>

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