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<blockquote data-quote="Jhaelen" data-source="post: 4574970" data-attributes="member: 46713">Okay, I think I understand your point now. You were hoping that in 4E there would no longer be any resources that you can run out of. Is that correct?IME, the 15 minute workday in 3E occured as soon as the casters ran out of their highest-level spells. They could still have 90% of their spells and noone would have to be wounded but they'd still refuse to continue because they felt they were now lacking their 'big guns'.If I was to compare this to 4E, I'd say it's similar to having used all of your dailys. This, I think, might lead to a similar phenomenon if the dailys were so much more powerful than encounter powers that the party didn't dare continue. I don't believe they are that much more powerful but I could understand it if there were people who think otherwise.Healing surges, however, are a different matter, imho. Unless the party has a very unusual setup or is not properly cooperating, I think, they'll use up their healing surges across the board. So if the party decides to stop for the day, it's not because a single person has run out of a critical resource but because they're all low on resources.To compare it to a similar situation in 3E would be a party where the 'tanks' are not fully healed and the healers have run out of healing spells. In 3E this was typically prevented from ever happening by using bucketloads of wands of CLW.And this is where I disagree. Yes, there are still limited resources, but they don't (or shouldn't!) result in the 15-minute workday.Healing surges in particular cannot be used up in a single encounter, it will always take several encounters for them to run out. Thus the 15-minute workday problem doesn't exist in 4E.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Jhaelen, post: 4574970, member: 46713"] Okay, I think I understand your point now. You were hoping that in 4E there would no longer be any resources that you can run out of. Is that correct? IME, the 15 minute workday in 3E occured as soon as the casters ran out of their highest-level spells. They could still have 90% of their spells and noone would have to be wounded but they'd still refuse to continue because they felt they were now lacking their 'big guns'. If I was to compare this to 4E, I'd say it's similar to having used all of your dailys. This, I think, might lead to a similar phenomenon if the dailys were so much more powerful than encounter powers that the party didn't dare continue. I don't believe they are that much more powerful but I could understand it if there were people who think otherwise. Healing surges, however, are a different matter, imho. Unless the party has a very unusual setup or is not properly cooperating, I think, they'll use up their healing surges across the board. So if the party decides to stop for the day, it's not because a single person has run out of a critical resource but because they're all low on resources. To compare it to a similar situation in 3E would be a party where the 'tanks' are not fully healed and the healers have run out of healing spells. In 3E this was typically prevented from ever happening by using bucketloads of wands of CLW. And this is where I disagree. Yes, there are still limited resources, but they don't (or shouldn't!) result in the 15-minute workday. Healing surges in particular cannot be used up in a single encounter, it will always take several encounters for them to run out. Thus the 15-minute workday problem doesn't exist in 4E. [/QUOTE]

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