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<blockquote data-quote="Neonchameleon" data-source="post: 5654466" data-attributes="member: 87792">You mean you were actually serious in that other thread?&nbsp;The Thief does not need any more support.&nbsp; It has two core books and two splat books worth of feats - it can take any rogue feats.&nbsp; It doesn't need more powers - it works as it is.&nbsp; More &quot;support&quot; for the thief would only reduce one of its virtues - simplicity of design.&nbsp;The Warden you have more of a point with.&nbsp; But instead of saying you want more support, say what you want!&nbsp; What is the new type of Warden you want?&nbsp; What new forms do you want?&nbsp; How big is the design space there?&nbsp; There's only a certain number of things it's worth doing with each class.&nbsp; And the Barbarian is stepping into the Warden's space with Heroes of the Feywild and it's &quot;Defender until raging&quot; build which is going to cover a lot of concepts the warden could fill.&nbsp; And there's nothing inherently wrong with that (is there a &quot;just damn strong&quot; warden build that isn't furry or rocky?)&nbsp;Now the people complaining that their runepriests or artificers aren't getting love have a point.&nbsp; I believe there's more to be done with the gadgeteering artificer - a pet build for one using an Iron Defender.&nbsp; But it's this type of support I want to see.&nbsp; Support involving new builds with a specific purpose.&nbsp; New concepts that can easily be modelled.&nbsp; Before Essentials there were 25 classes.&nbsp; Most of which had four or more basic class options before you started on powers.&nbsp; That's over a hundred basic concepts you have there not counting emergent ones like the Lazy Warlord.&nbsp; Just a generic complaint you want moar support makes me ask &quot;for what?&quot;&nbsp; Or even why you want to clutter up the game further.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Neonchameleon, post: 5654466, member: 87792"] You mean you were actually serious in that other thread? The Thief does not [I]need[/I] any more support. It has two core books and two splat books worth of feats - it can take any rogue feats. It doesn't need more powers - it works as it is. More "support" for the thief would only reduce one of its virtues - simplicity of design. The Warden you have more of a point with. But instead of saying you want more support, [I]say what you want![/I] What is the new type of Warden you want? What new forms do you want? How big is the design space there? There's only a certain number of things it's worth doing with each class. And the Barbarian is stepping into the Warden's space with Heroes of the Feywild and it's "Defender until raging" build which is going to cover a lot of concepts the warden could fill. And there's nothing inherently wrong with that (is there a "just damn strong" warden build that isn't furry or rocky?) Now the people complaining that their runepriests or artificers aren't getting love have a point. I believe there's more to be done with the gadgeteering artificer - a pet build for one using an Iron Defender. But it's [I]this[/I] type of support I want to see. Support involving new builds [I]with a specific purpose[/I]. New concepts that can easily be modelled. Before Essentials there were [I]25[/I] classes. Most of which had four or more basic class options before you started on powers. That's over a hundred basic concepts you have there not counting emergent ones like the Lazy Warlord. Just a generic complaint you want moar support makes me ask "for what?" Or even why you want to clutter up the game further. [/QUOTE]

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