Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
White Dwarf Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Nest
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
EN Publishing
Twitter
BlueSky
Facebook
Instagram
EN World
BlueSky
YouTube
Facebook
Twitter
Twitch
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
Reconsidering Pathfinder over 4E
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="Celtavian" data-source="post: 5508915" data-attributes="member: 5834"><p>I think it would be a fairly large pain to convert 3.x to <em>Pathfinder</em>. The classes are very different now as are many of the powers and the little perks. Not impossible. But the material isn't fully interchangeable without work.</p><p></p><p>Every single class is very different from the old classes including many of the Prcs. And the disadvantages of multi-classing are substantial and not made up for with the perks in a PrC. There is a decided bias against Prcs in <em>Pathfinder</em>, very substantial if you use the <em>Advanced Player's Guide</em>.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>No synergy bonuses any longer.</p><p></p><p>Skills are level by level. Flat amount. All skills are 1 point for one point. Only advantage class skills is +3 bonus.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>That's what a druid does.</p><p></p><p>Wild shaping is simpler now. It goes off your base stats. Everything is clearly defined and easy to adjudicated. You no longer need to look in the monster book to see what happens with your stats or define your powers except to see what the specific elemental power (like burn, vortex) gets.</p><p></p><p>I think it would be difficult to build a druid that does everything. But if you wanted to focus on wild shaping, you could make a pretty cool druid melee with more feats and a simpler understanding of how wild shaping works.</p><p></p><p>I hope you're ready for all the stuff that comes with 3E unless you plan to do 15 point standard point buy. The prep time is still insane if you want to challenge a party that is built on rolled stats or anything other than 15 point point buy, near exact gold for gear distribution and the like.</p><p></p><p>And the melee are worse monsters than they used to be. It will be hard for even an optimized melee druid to hold the jockstrap of an optimized fighter, barbarian, or paladin. They are sickeningly strong in terms of damage dealing if they wield two-handed weapons and incredibly hard to kill.</p><p></p><p>They gave physical damage classes a lot of power in <em>Pathfinder</em>. They are unbelievably beefy and dangerous. Certain choices are outstanding, the most notable being the following:</p><p></p><p>1. Invulnerable rager barbarian with beast totem, come and get me, and superstition.</p><p></p><p>2. Two-hander fighter. Nothing can withstand them for more than a few rounds if they hit.</p><p></p><p>3. The archer is now probably the king of killing. The average high level archter will end up with 6 attacks a round without <em>haste</em>. They now have the equivalent of power attack called Deadly Aim. And if you make a dedicated fighter archer, you will do damage at range like no other class. You'll be the elf archer in Hawk the Slayer.</p><p></p><p>4. The Inquisitor: This class gets too dang much.</p><p></p><p>Be ready for a 3.x like game. A lot of stuff going on at high level. It's epic fantasy of the most extreme kind. High level <em>Pathfinder</em> characters are more like super heroes, even the melees.</p><p></p><p>The wizard and priests could always do pretty epic stuff with magic at high level in D&D. But now the melees are beastly and can do as many things to mess up your encounters besides just damage.</p><p></p><p>For example, I have a two-handed fighter with whirlwind attack and 10 foot reach that has this feat called stunning assault which allows him to hit for 40 plus damage everything within 10 feet of him stunning it. There are quite a few vicious feat combinations like that.</p><p></p><p>So go into the change with eyes wide open. At high level, <em>Pathfinder</em> is as hard, if not more difficult, to run than 3.x was. You have to amp up the enemies to compete with the players insane capabilties.</p><p></p><p>Mind you, I still like <em>Pathfinder</em>. It's a fun game. The Paizo APs are the best adventures I've ever read, even better than old school D&D modules. But it's 3.x with amped up melee characters and not a great deal of reduced power for arcane and divine casters (though no <em>Spell Compendium</em> which helps a great deal...at least not yet). If you liked the narrative style and spell strategy of 3.x, then you'll enjoy <em>Pathfinder</em>.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Celtavian, post: 5508915, member: 5834"] I think it would be a fairly large pain to convert 3.x to [i]Pathfinder[/i]. The classes are very different now as are many of the powers and the little perks. Not impossible. But the material isn't fully interchangeable without work. Every single class is very different from the old classes including many of the Prcs. And the disadvantages of multi-classing are substantial and not made up for with the perks in a PrC. There is a decided bias against Prcs in [i]Pathfinder[/i], very substantial if you use the [i]Advanced Player's Guide[/i]. No synergy bonuses any longer. Skills are level by level. Flat amount. All skills are 1 point for one point. Only advantage class skills is +3 bonus. That's what a druid does. Wild shaping is simpler now. It goes off your base stats. Everything is clearly defined and easy to adjudicated. You no longer need to look in the monster book to see what happens with your stats or define your powers except to see what the specific elemental power (like burn, vortex) gets. I think it would be difficult to build a druid that does everything. But if you wanted to focus on wild shaping, you could make a pretty cool druid melee with more feats and a simpler understanding of how wild shaping works. I hope you're ready for all the stuff that comes with 3E unless you plan to do 15 point standard point buy. The prep time is still insane if you want to challenge a party that is built on rolled stats or anything other than 15 point point buy, near exact gold for gear distribution and the like. And the melee are worse monsters than they used to be. It will be hard for even an optimized melee druid to hold the jockstrap of an optimized fighter, barbarian, or paladin. They are sickeningly strong in terms of damage dealing if they wield two-handed weapons and incredibly hard to kill. They gave physical damage classes a lot of power in [i]Pathfinder[/i]. They are unbelievably beefy and dangerous. Certain choices are outstanding, the most notable being the following: 1. Invulnerable rager barbarian with beast totem, come and get me, and superstition. 2. Two-hander fighter. Nothing can withstand them for more than a few rounds if they hit. 3. The archer is now probably the king of killing. The average high level archter will end up with 6 attacks a round without [i]haste[/i]. They now have the equivalent of power attack called Deadly Aim. And if you make a dedicated fighter archer, you will do damage at range like no other class. You'll be the elf archer in Hawk the Slayer. 4. The Inquisitor: This class gets too dang much. Be ready for a 3.x like game. A lot of stuff going on at high level. It's epic fantasy of the most extreme kind. High level [i]Pathfinder[/i] characters are more like super heroes, even the melees. The wizard and priests could always do pretty epic stuff with magic at high level in D&D. But now the melees are beastly and can do as many things to mess up your encounters besides just damage. For example, I have a two-handed fighter with whirlwind attack and 10 foot reach that has this feat called stunning assault which allows him to hit for 40 plus damage everything within 10 feet of him stunning it. There are quite a few vicious feat combinations like that. So go into the change with eyes wide open. At high level, [i]Pathfinder[/i] is as hard, if not more difficult, to run than 3.x was. You have to amp up the enemies to compete with the players insane capabilties. Mind you, I still like [i]Pathfinder[/i]. It's a fun game. The Paizo APs are the best adventures I've ever read, even better than old school D&D modules. But it's 3.x with amped up melee characters and not a great deal of reduced power for arcane and divine casters (though no [i]Spell Compendium[/i] which helps a great deal...at least not yet). If you liked the narrative style and spell strategy of 3.x, then you'll enjoy [i]Pathfinder[/i]. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
Reconsidering Pathfinder over 4E
Top