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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Guest&nbsp; 85555" data-source="post: 8496653">I don't think evolution is always a baseline assumption in the lore. Part of the issue is creatures like orcs have varied a lot from one edition to the next. I am sure there are people who are better equipped than me to quibble over lore features, but just looking at the basic entry from Moldvay as an example, it doesn't say anything about them having evolved. It doesn't say they didn't either. But it is still an edition that seems very strongly rooted in that cosmic battle between law and chaos. Also I don't think in game they are necessarily the embodiment of chaos, they are in alignment with it. But my point is, people who view that conflict, as figurative (i.e. their character may be slaying an orc, but they are really contending with larger cosmic issues) are coming at it from a Three Hearts Three Lions perspective (it has been a while since I read it, but if I recall the character starts in our world, during world war II and goes to a world that is like our legendary past, where you have mythical creatures embroiled in a cosmic war. And that experience ultimately leads the character to become Catholic at the end. I would see that as very much being a world that is more about the character dealing with these forces within his own soul, than him literally going to a parallel world. And I think that is how some people see things like orcs in a game. Again it has been a long time since I read it, and I am not a huge fan of this genre. But when I talk with gamers who like the whole cosmically evil orc thing, they are either coming at it from an almost parody-like Warhammer view, or from a view where this is meant to reflect deeper spiritual battles or mythic battles happening on a cosmic scale. And then there are also people who just like the convenience of having evil monsters to kill for XP, and aren't particularly worried about what it means. That exists too. In terms of enlightenment, I don't think how we play games or how we engage in pop culture is particularly reflective of how enlightened we are. Just my opinion. But I think we are much better off looking elsewhere for that.</blockquote>

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