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<blockquote data-quote="pemerton" data-source="post: 7067348" data-attributes="member: 42582">Sure. I didn't take that to be in dispute.Personally I don't think that's the only reading of the devotion paladin. I also don't think it's the only reading of the redemption paladin (ie that they be given a second chance). To say it would be in character to try and redeem them isn't at all to say that they must be given a second chance - after all, under the heading &quot;wisdom&quot; we are told that &quot;While every creature can be redeemed, some are so far along the path of evil that you have no choice but to end their lives for the greater good.&quot; I also don't think the redeemer has be be averse to punishment. A very standard theme in the contemporary literature on the &quot;expressive&quot; theory of punishment is that the wrongdoer only demonstrates genuine remorse (and hence genuinely achieves redemption) by undergoing the penance that punishment consists in.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="pemerton, post: 7067348, member: 42582"] Sure. I didn't take that to be in dispute. Personally I don't think that's the only reading of the devotion paladin. I also don't think it's the only reading of the redemption paladin (ie that they be given a second chance). To say it would be in character to try and redeem them isn't at all to say that they [I]must [/I]be given a second chance - after all, under the heading "wisdom" we are told that "While every creature can be redeemed, some are so far along the path of evil that you have no choice but to end their lives for the greater good." I also don't think the redeemer has be be averse to punishment. A very standard theme in the contemporary literature on the "expressive" theory of punishment is that the wrongdoer only demonstrates genuine remorse (and hence genuinely achieves redemption) by undergoing the penance that punishment consists in. [/QUOTE]

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