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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Celebrim" data-source="post: 9860437" data-attributes="member: 4937">We have a lot of the same ideas, although you missed that in addition to fixing the thief I'm also blanket answering questions like "Ok, so what happens if the non-thief wants to climb walls or move silently?"  Also the full design (and understanding it) may require a full NWP (for thieves) write up, since I'm leaning into that as a means of addressing skill use.  Even 2e was overly conservative in its write up of NWPs just as 3e designers were overly conservative when addressing skills, because both designers didn't want to add something that was game breaking.  There were some feat like experiments in 2e though, and I think hindsight shows that is really where the design should have gone.Addressing your changes:1) We're doing basically the same thing here only I'm leaning into the failure/failure with consequences model of Pick Pocket and applying it universally.  You generally don't get consequences unless you fail by worse than 21%.2) Passive skill usage sounds like a good thing and can be justified but tends to put a burden on the GM to remember to do all that, and I hate shifting burdens to the DM.3) I'd be interested in seeing your skill list, even though I'd probably turn most of them into NWPs, they probably have some good ideas.4) As you can see, all thieves get Evasion as well (assuming they invest in it) as well as pretty much all the Acrobat abilities without having to switch to a new class.  Under these rules, you can run a thief that is acrobat-like just by focusing your skill improvement on those areas, or one more traditional by focusing on the traditional thief skills.  Or you can jack-of-all trades if you are willing to be about 70-80% in all areas by the time you hit 10th level.5) Bonus skill points for being human and/or high INT, not just because this 3e innovation made a lot of sense, but because the original thief write up listed intelligence as the secondary attribute of a thief but didn't mechanically back that up.6) This will come from the more 'feat like' NWPs I plan to right up, albeit I might not post those for several weeks.  In any event, neither of the ones you listed are necessary though, since all thieves in this write up are effectively getting both advantages.</blockquote>

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