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<blockquote data-quote="Umbran" data-source="post: 5436645" data-attributes="member: 177">As a model of the real world, the two aren't really redundant.&nbsp; There are lots of people who are dexterous but not agile, and vice versa.&nbsp; An old watchmaker may be dexterous (great eye-hand coordination and control) but not agile (he's a lousy dancer).&nbsp; And a football player may be great at moving his body on the field (agile) but fumble-fingered with the remote control of his TV (not too dexterous).And, at the same time, it sounds like you want t wrap together some things that really aren't redundant - fighting and strength?&nbsp; The ability to land a punch is the same as the ability to lift a Mack truck?&nbsp; What if you want martial artists who are amazingly good at fighting, but can't bend iron girders?&nbsp; Stepping away from the simulation aspects, I think the matter of over-valued stats is probably central to the issue.&nbsp; If you used to have two stats (Agility and Dexterity) and two skills (dodge and parry), and you reduce them to one and one, now it is much easier and cheaper to be extremely good at not getting hit.Basically, you're wrapping up one very valuable package there, and giving it away for the same price.&nbsp; Are you sure you want to do that?The dividing line there is kind of arbitrary - I've played fine RPGs that only had 3 stats, so 4 is certainly workable.&nbsp; However, those systems that have fewer stats have chosen to drop the level of detail across the board, and d20 isn't really a low-detail ruleset to use as a core for this.&nbsp; You'll end up rewriting most of the feats and skills to pull it off, re-balancing character creation and advancement.&nbsp; Quite a job ahead of you.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Umbran, post: 5436645, member: 177"] As a model of the real world, the two aren't really redundant. There are lots of people who are dexterous but not agile, and vice versa. An old watchmaker may be dexterous (great eye-hand coordination and control) but not agile (he's a lousy dancer). And a football player may be great at moving his body on the field (agile) but fumble-fingered with the remote control of his TV (not too dexterous). And, at the same time, it sounds like you want t wrap together some things that really aren't redundant - fighting and strength? The ability to land a punch is the same as the ability to lift a Mack truck? What if you want martial artists who are amazingly good at fighting, but can't bend iron girders? Stepping away from the simulation aspects, I think the matter of over-valued stats is probably central to the issue. If you used to have two stats (Agility and Dexterity) and two skills (dodge and parry), and you reduce them to one and one, now it is much easier and cheaper to be extremely good at not getting hit. Basically, you're wrapping up one very valuable package there, and giving it away for the same price. Are you sure you want to do that? The dividing line there is kind of arbitrary - I've played fine RPGs that only had 3 stats, so 4 is certainly workable. However, those systems that have fewer stats have chosen to drop the level of detail across the board, and d20 isn't really a low-detail ruleset to use as a core for this. You'll end up rewriting most of the feats and skills to pull it off, re-balancing character creation and advancement. Quite a job ahead of you. [/QUOTE]

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