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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Composer99" data-source="post: 8805425" data-attributes="member: 7030042">Your particular video game analogy, which refers to tutorials, does not hold in specific reply to my post, because I am talking about DMG-as-reference-manual.It also doesn't hold up, as it turns out, with respect to reference manuals. Here is a list of video games I own that have been published in the last 10 years that have separate user manuals (I looked them up):<ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Fantasy General II</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Pillars of Eternity</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">X-Com 2</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Divinity: Original Sin (1 and 2)</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Fell Seal: Arbiter's Mark</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Phantom Doctrine</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">D&D Tales from Candlekeep - Tomb of Annihilation</li> </ul>Honourable mentions go to Age of Wonders 3 and Age of Wonders Planetfall, which, while they do not have separate user manuals, have in-game "cyclopedias" that serve the same function. I stopped playing Stellaris after maybe 15 minutes, so I couldn't say for sure whether it has an in-game "cyclopedia" or not, but it wouldn't surprise me in the least if it did.There is no expectation that players will read them cover-to-cover, or even that they will look them up at all, whether during or outside of gameplay. Nevertheless, they are available for those who want to make use of them. I am sure that if I cared to search more, I would find other games in my library that also have these manuals, to say nothing of how many video games I don't own that might have in-built or separate reference manuals.Finally, and most importantly - running a game of Dungeons and Dragons, the TTRPG, is not in any way, shape, or form, the same as playing a video game. Not in the slightest.[HR][/HR]You'll notice that my remark about chapter 10 of the PHB was using your own words; it's pointing out that the line of thinking you use follows to an absurd ending. After all, if the game is about "rulings, not rules", and if people are big kids who can look words up in the dictionary, you could scrap almost the entire chapter and just have a definition for concentration in a glossary. Certainly I expect plenty of folks reading off their class description's spellcasting feature and the description for, say, <a href="https://5thsrd.org/spellcasting/spells/bless/" target="_blank">bless</a>, could probably figure out how to cast that spell without ever looking in chapter 10. And yet, there chapter 10 still is![HR][/HR]Frankly, what you're coming across (especially in later posts) as arguing is that the DMG ought to be written or structured so as to cater specifically to what you personally want out of it - or at least that it ought not be written or structured so as to cater to anyone who wants or might want something else (or something more). That is an argument that, to my mind, is without merit on its face. Maybe that's not what you're meaning to argue, but I can't respond to what you intend, only what you write.That's on top of the blatant strawmen, which are becoming exceedingly tiring - whether or not that's your intent, it's pretty hard to parse loaded language such as "spoon feed [...] in excruciating detail" as anything other than a strawman argument that is intentionally inflammatory. Other reference or instructional manuals for hobbyists - gardening, model trains, cross-stich, you name it - have concrete examples where the writers feel they are warranted, meaning it is an industry standard, accepted by professional writers across multiple hobbies and disciplines, that such documents ought to have concrete examples to assist in making their concepts clear to new and experienced users alike. And on your say-so alone, I and folks of like mind are supposed to agree that the DMG or a starter set would be made worse by hewing closer to such a standard? I think not.In all fairness, I would agree with such people that the DMG does not have to be structured as an instructional manual for new DMs - much like how the user manual for Finale 2009 is definitely not an instructional manual for new users of Finale 2009, much less a teaching tool for learning how to write music generally.I'm also not sure that a starter set is meant to serve as a generic instructional manual - instead, the adventure included is the instructional manual. That being said, I do own the first starter set and while it mentions that you might have to make improvised calls about ability checks on the fly, it doesn't provide any concrete examples.With all that said, I expect the DMG would be used by new and experienced DMs alike, so it probably shouldn't be devoid of guidance for newer DMs, even if it's not structured specifically to help them learn to run a game.</blockquote>

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