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Regarding the complexity of Pathfinder 2
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<blockquote data-quote="kenada" data-source="post: 8108769" data-attributes="member: 70468"><p>There are a couple of things to unpack here. I agree that a group new to a game is likely to look towards official adventures to see how it plays. I think they’ll made a good faith effort to runt he rules as written, but I expect most groups to diverge from what’s written in the adventure because that’s just what happens in an RPG.</p><p></p><p>I’m pushing back on the idea that <em>everything</em> has to be run <em>as written</em> because it feels like that’s being used as a way to constrain the discourse, so that we naturally have to draw the right conclusion. We can’t suggest ways of remedying problems or alternate approaches because that undermines the constraints that are necessary for the argument. It has to be as written. It has to be for a specific style.</p><p></p><p>It may be that PF2 adventures just aren’t very good for the kick-in-the-door style without some tweaking. That tweaking could be to the adventure, or it could be to the system by just letting everyone heal up or whatever. If the intent were figuring out how to make that work, I think we collectively could figure something out. I don’t feel that’s the intent. It’s like telling your doctor it hurts when you do something, your doctor tells you to stop doing that, and you tell them you can’t because you need to prove that it hurts.</p><p></p><p>I’ll also add I don’t think kick-in-the-door is the presumed default style for official adventures. There wouldn’t be any point to exploration mode or downtime mode if the adventures were just about going from encounter to encounter with the in-between happening automatically for the most part. They’re not sandboxes, but there are other options between those two extremes.</p><p></p><p></p><p>Yep. And that sucks. I’ve said multiple times that I think Paizo made a mistake with the difficulty of the adventures they’re releasing. That people in your group apparently want to continue playing in spite of the difficulties is a credit to Paizo I suppose, but it still doesn’t sound like a very fun experience. Hopefully the changes you are making will improve the experience.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="kenada, post: 8108769, member: 70468"] There are a couple of things to unpack here. I agree that a group new to a game is likely to look towards official adventures to see how it plays. I think they’ll made a good faith effort to runt he rules as written, but I expect most groups to diverge from what’s written in the adventure because that’s just what happens in an RPG. I’m pushing back on the idea that [I]everything[/I] has to be run [I]as written[/I] because it feels like that’s being used as a way to constrain the discourse, so that we naturally have to draw the right conclusion. We can’t suggest ways of remedying problems or alternate approaches because that undermines the constraints that are necessary for the argument. It has to be as written. It has to be for a specific style. It may be that PF2 adventures just aren’t very good for the kick-in-the-door style without some tweaking. That tweaking could be to the adventure, or it could be to the system by just letting everyone heal up or whatever. If the intent were figuring out how to make that work, I think we collectively could figure something out. I don’t feel that’s the intent. It’s like telling your doctor it hurts when you do something, your doctor tells you to stop doing that, and you tell them you can’t because you need to prove that it hurts. I’ll also add I don’t think kick-in-the-door is the presumed default style for official adventures. There wouldn’t be any point to exploration mode or downtime mode if the adventures were just about going from encounter to encounter with the in-between happening automatically for the most part. They’re not sandboxes, but there are other options between those two extremes. Yep. And that sucks. I’ve said multiple times that I think Paizo made a mistake with the difficulty of the adventures they’re releasing. That people in your group apparently want to continue playing in spite of the difficulties is a credit to Paizo I suppose, but it still doesn’t sound like a very fun experience. Hopefully the changes you are making will improve the experience. [/QUOTE]
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