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<blockquote data-quote="nevin" data-source="post: 8119723" data-attributes="member: 7024481">I agree it's in a large part up to DM.&nbsp; However in my experience Pathfinder seems to either intensify the problem (or maybe it's just the kind of people attracted to it.)&nbsp;&nbsp; I know people that just do dungeon crawls.&nbsp; the thing is pathfinder has combat completely segmented down to the Actions and movements and every single thing about the game is getting tactical advantage.&nbsp; &nbsp; The combats take a lot more time than in other systems because of that.&nbsp; And finally if you go to the pathfinder forums and make an observation about this you'll almost certainly be told how to play the game &quot;Optimally&quot;.&nbsp; It seems to start at the top, be baked into the system and heavily reinforced by the min max mindset of the player's that seem to be attracted to the &quot;crunchy&quot; stuff. As far as players feeling like they have to get thier 10 minute rest or other things that's a problem Gaming in general is suffering through.&nbsp; The idea that the Game developer is responsible for balance, through the rules , has the negative effect of teaching the DM's to defer to the rulebook everytime.&nbsp; That and younger players who all seem to think if DM fudges a roll, or does something that's not in a book, that they've been screwed.&nbsp;&nbsp; I think that's a generational problem, caused by telling children they can grow up to do what ever they want, and that everyone is a special snowflake.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="nevin, post: 8119723, member: 7024481"] I agree it's in a large part up to DM. However in my experience Pathfinder seems to either intensify the problem (or maybe it's just the kind of people attracted to it.) I know people that just do dungeon crawls. the thing is pathfinder has combat completely segmented down to the Actions and movements and every single thing about the game is getting tactical advantage. The combats take a lot more time than in other systems because of that. And finally if you go to the pathfinder forums and make an observation about this you'll almost certainly be told how to play the game "Optimally". It seems to start at the top, be baked into the system and heavily reinforced by the min max mindset of the player's that seem to be attracted to the "crunchy" stuff. As far as players feeling like they have to get thier 10 minute rest or other things that's a problem Gaming in general is suffering through. The idea that the Game developer is responsible for balance, through the rules , has the negative effect of teaching the DM's to defer to the rulebook everytime. That and younger players who all seem to think if DM fudges a roll, or does something that's not in a book, that they've been screwed. I think that's a generational problem, caused by telling children they can grow up to do what ever they want, and that everyone is a special snowflake. [/QUOTE]

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