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Message: <blockquote data-quote="xoth.publishing" data-source="post: 8141583" data-attributes="member: 6986003">Just curious (and slightly off-topic, so feel free to answer in a separate thread if you'd like). I've noted that you have stated multiple times that combat in PF2 is good, and this is (IIRC) because the monsters have cool and unique abilities.Also, 5E is sometimes criticized because many of the monsters are just "bags of hit points" with no special abilities.I have no experience with PF2 but I just took a look at some iconic monsters in the SRD.<ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Orc: PF2 has the Orc Brute (with the Ferocity special ability), Orc Warrior (again with Ferocity), and the Orc Warchief (Ferocity and War Cry). 5E has the Orc (with the Aggressive ability), Orog (also Aggresive), and Orc War Chief (Aggressive, Gruumsh's Fury, Battle Cry). Seems about equal to me in terms of special abilities?</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Ghoul: PF2 has the Ghoul (paralyzing attack, and Swift Leap, and also Ghoul Fever and Consume Flesh). 5E has the Ghoul (paralyzing attack). Slightly more options in PF2 here.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Vampire: PF2 has the Vampire Count (Children of the Night, Change Shape, Create Spawn, Dominate, Drink Blood, Turn to Mist/Mist Escape). 5E has the Vampire (Children of the Night, Shapechanger, Bite/Create Spawn, Charm, Legendary Resistance, Regeneration, Spider Climb, Vampire Weaknesses, Misty Escape). More or less the same, with slighty more in 5E.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">I could go on... are there better examples that illustrate the diffences?</li> </ul>Some questions to ponder:<ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Is it true (and does it matter?) that monsters in 5E have less special abilities?</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Can there be too many special abilities and options, slowing down the game?</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Can GMs who feel that 5E monsters are just "bags of hit points" take a look at the corresponding PF2 monster for inspiration and add a cool ability or two to the 5E monster?</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Do monsters in later 5E books (Volo's, Mordenkainen's, etc) have more special abilities than the MM ones?</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">What about using books such as Monster Manual Expanded (by "Dragonix") which feature many variations on base monsters?</li> </ul>I realize most of these questions have to do with 5E and not PF2 (I already said the question was slightly off-topic!). I guess the question most relevant to PF2 is why, given that you feel that PF2 has all this other baggage of complexity, would you not just play 5E with some beefed-up monsters?</blockquote>

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