Relaunching the Dusk setting, Looking for Advice, Suggestions and Help

[Michael Morris]

Well, after about three weeks of mulling in the back of my brain while the front of my brain was working on reviews code I've decided that I will relaunch the setting. Unlike the previous two editions, I'm not going to develop it in secret. Instead I'm going to hash it out more or less publically. If enough interest develops to warrant a seperate forum I'll reopen the appropriate forums, but for now the thread will drift around here.

I want to return to the starting point. Retain key concepts, characters and features perhaps; but I'm open to recasting pretty much anything if the results are more interesting and vibrant. Near the end of it's 3rd edition Dusk stagnated and became a hardly more than "yet another fantasy setting." Well, after setting it aside 6 months and working on other things it's time to change that - and hopefully with help.

What is Dusk?

The story of the Kingdom of Dalsundria - more or less. Dalsundria is a land caught in civil war which, at campaign's opening, has been going on - sporadically - for 200 years. It is not a medieval setting, rather it is a bronze age culture that has arisen in the shadow of a dimly remembered conflict.

The setting has a rich and complicated history, but that history only pertains to the last 400 years or so. Much of what came before isn't well remembered or understood so it's rarely discussed.

The Dusk setting was first put online in November 1995, some 10 years ago. It began as a 60 page collection of notes. All the notes and incomplete books I have on file now total well over 400 pages - but I'm willing to cast most if not all of it away to start again. With that in mind, if it's not in this thread, I may not include it.

What changes?
Ok, let's step back and deal with some ideas and changes in d20 that the setting will require to some extent. Previously I've tried to keep the setting as close to the PHB as possible. While this is has worked up to now, there are directions I want to go that preclude this.

Magic
I tire of the sometimes artificial dicotomy of divine / arcane magic. The line is so blurry now, what with bards casting cures and priests somethings getting offensive spells through domains, why bother with it.

I want a system of five magics not unlike Magic: The Gathering. Each type of magic has two allies and two enemies. The very energies themselves oppose and attract. They further spill into alignment - creatures in the setting are aligned just as spells are aligned. This affects how well magic functions for and upon characters.

Rather than use cleric / druid / sorcerer and wizard - allow three methods to cast based on the divine, arcane or the self. The allows for clerics, wizards and the like in title, but rather than balance the spell lists of the classes - make sure the classes are balanced against each other regardless of their spell list. The reason is that I want magic acquisition to be more fluid (though perhaps not as fluid as Elements of Magic) A character can learn a wide variety of spells or focus on a tight selection of spells - the idea being that while any character can learn any spell this cannot be achieved by any one character at any one time. Learning one type of magic precludes learning the magics opposed to it.

Classes which are secondary casters (bards, rangers, paladins) become prestige classes as per Unearthed Arcana.

I want to be able to keep fighters, rogues, barbarians and the like unchanged.


Setting
I want to move to an Early Greek / Mycenian model for the setting's technology and attire, though slightly modified to reflect Telzoa's cold and inhospitible climate. This arrangement should mesh more tightly with the polytheistic setting as opposed to the unique juxtaposition that D&D has with a polytheistic medieval world where historically it was monotheistic. Indivudual deities and the like will be touched on - I want to allow this part to remain largely unchanged because the mythologies of Telzoa are a dear spot to my heart, and it was a lot of work to reach the point that they are now. I'll have to make some changes though to lock more tightly to the new 5 point alignement system as opposed to the 9 point they were designed under.

With bronze age comes bronze weapons, yet in the south the Estarian empire has and should continue to have iron technology, though in it's infancy. Couple of rules that don't over complicate things need to be thought up when dealing with bronze v. iron.


Ok, I'm going to rest a bit before typing more. Note to the Mods. For the moment, this thread is at a conceptual stage. No direct game mechanics - yet, therefore I placed the thread here.

 

[Carnifex]

As a note, when I've come across Dusk material or I've seen you mention it before, the only parts I ever really seemed to encounter were to do with the 5 colour magic system, which is interesting enough but didn't inspire me to check out the Dusk setting as a whole (which I have to admit, I pretty much assumed would be 'yet another bland fantasy setting' except for the magic variant). However, reading this I'm seeing the stuff about a more bronze-age/iron age setting rather than medieval, and this is, to me, a *far* better way to stimulate interest in Dusk rather than just the magic system, as it actually makes the setting itself different from other standard medieval fantasy settings whereas the magic system looked like you didn't really need to bother with Dusk itself to use it.

Now you actually have my interest

 

[Michael Morris]

So, where do we begin then? Equipment lists I suppose, and clothing, what about maps? Maps are always fun.

Do we go large and work back down, or start small and go out in size? Either way works with me. What I don't want to create is an info overload.

 

[reason]

...

My Principia Infecta is in essence the result of a hard look at what I could do with the piles and piles of setting material I have accumulated over my unnaturally long life. If you start from the assumption that you aren't going to get past the point you are at now in any rewrite/relaunch/reprocess - no slander, just a good assumption to make - then the question becomes how do you carry on so as to best share what's in your head and notes, have fun doing it, and hit the other goals you have in mind?

In my case, it's a world building blog with story focus. In your case, what?

Reason
Principia Infecta

 

[Michael Morris]

I really don't get that post. Are you recommending a blog format? If so, no thanks. Are you looking to spam this thread with your setting? If so, not appreciated.

 

[BiggusGeekus]

Its funny, I was addressing this issue on RPG.net today.

You don't want it to be "just another fantasy setting" (aka "fantasy heartbreaker'). But the second you have wizards zapping people you're automatically going to get tossed in that group. I think that's incredibly stupid, but that's the way it goes. I use a Tolkien-esque setting in Murchad's Legacy but that doesn't change how the game is played, the campaign mechanics and how I used the feat system does.

For example:

If you have an advanced race, they're elves. If you have a thuggish race, they're orcs. If you have an industrious race, they're dwarves. If you have a race that has no real purpose other than to have nifty powers, they're gnomes. Eliminating the Tolkien races doesn't change the game. Changing the game changes the game.

So....

Would it be in the spirit of the game to have bronze easier to enchant than iron? That'd be a cool way to set up magic-vs-technology.

Another thing you could do is tie your magic system to the alignment system. For example, Necromancy and Evocation could be INT-based and not castable by good characters. Divination and Enchantment could be WIS-based and not castable by evil characters.
Conjuration could be CHA-based and castable by anyone.

You have a civil war. OK, cool. Step one is to figure out what each side gets in terms of bonuses and pentalties. Step two is to figure out why each side would adventure together because players are going to want to make your life miserable with stuff likethat.

Just my two cents!

 

[reason]

I really don't get that post. Are you recommending a blog format? If so, no thanks. Are you looking to spam this thread with your setting? If so, not appreciated.

I was recommending a blog format as something to think about, plus a re-examination of *why* you are relaunching and what you hope to achieve - otherwise you'll just be doing exactly the same thing in a year or three from now with a different vision of the setting; it seemed fairly clear from your initial post that that wasn't where you wanted to be.

Reason
Principia Infecta

 

[Tonguez]

So, where do we begin then? Equipment lists I suppose, and clothing, what about maps? Maps are always fun.

Do we go large and work back down, or start small and go out in size? Either way works with me. What I don't want to create is an info overload.

You need to emphasise the Bronze age aspects of the setting (like the way shaman which I yoinked from your Dusk material)
As carnifex says emphasiszing just another magic system or just another race isn't going to inspire as much as a look at a 'new' and different cultural millieu is

 

[Michael Morris]

Well, one reason I'm relaunching so radically is a little play called Electra, and the whole Orestia cycle. I've been enchanted by these stories on a stronger basis than Tolkien ever captivated me.

Speaking of Tolkien, and the races - well the moment you start taking races away some folk complain. So I would rather examine the races on my own terms. This is what I have concerning Elves.


Elves

Elves are the most prominent of the “sylvan” races of Carthasana. Humans often see them as idealic versions of themselves, yet the free spirit of the elves has grated on the nerves of more than one human king and emperor. While elves are willing to be allies, they are not willing to be servants.

Physiology: While physically closer to humans than any other race on Carthasana, the elves are upon close examination more alien than any other race. While grotesque in visage, goblins, orcs, ogres and the like share humanity’s frailties of disease and mortality. Elves are free of these concerns, and this freedom shapes their very psychology on a level that is not easily appreciated or understood.

As has been said many a time in Telzoa, appearances deceive – the elves are not like us.

Longevity: The most dramatic difference between elves and humans is longevity. Elves live to approximately 300 years, though individuals over 400 years old aren’t unknown. To human eyes elves seem to live forever and seem to have all the time in the world to explore the nuances of this or that craft.

In addition to a naturally long lifespan elves are immune to all diseases that affect humans. Elves however do have to contend to diseases unique to their species – most of which are at least partially magical and difficult to treat. They also are in danger of dying from an ailment called the ashtasila sundre, or “weary death” where an elf becomes so depressed from his memories and experiences that he goes into a catatonic state and starves to death.

Senses: Elves are generally believed (and they frequently brag) of having better senses all around than a humans. This is mostly true.

The elven eye is about twice as sensitive to light as a human’s having a far more dense concentration of rods than a human’s. It is also about a quarter size larger than a human eye. Elven eyes have a much more reflective timpanic membrane behind the retina that reflects unabsorbed light back to the retina for a second try at absorbtion. Some of this light escapes though so an elf’s eye shines in the dark just as a cat or dog’s will.

This visual acuity comes at some price. The muscles that move the eye are less developed in an elf than in a human. This means that an elf cannot look out of the corner of their eyes or cast a sidelong glance at someone. To follow most objects an elf must move her entire head just an owl does (which can’t move it’s eyes at all). Elves also have a greater likelihood of being born colorblind than humans.

Elves have a functioning and transparent third eyelid that protects the eye from flashblindness (the lack of this third eyelid by goblinoids is why they are vulnerable to flash blindness and elves are not).

Elves have a more sensitive and higher hearing range than humans. An elf can hear a “dog whistle” and it isn’t uncommon for elven scouting parties to use such whistles as signals their foes can’t intercept. Despite this advantage, elves are no better at discerning the direction of a sound than humans are.

Elves have about the same sense of smell and taste as humans, and their sense of touch is actually weaker at picking up temperature changes than humans.

Extrasensory: Elves have an almost instinctual sense when it comes to magic. Even those with no training whatsoever can feel the presence of a spell if they enter its area of effect (and with most spells by then, it’s too late).

Elves also have the ability to feel the emotions of those they touch. Two elves holding hands know the emotions of the other and they, as a rule, find physical contact more desireable at all times than humans. Elves like to touch and be touched and they don’t discriminate sexually in this regard. A typical elf would prefer to have someone else groom them or to groom another than to groom themselves. So great is this need for contact that those who capture elves frequently have learned that solitary confinement works wondered on the elven resolve.

Physical Build: Elves have a much less dense bone structure than humans. Though their bones are about the same size, they are more hollow. Major bones such as the femur (legbone) and hip have strips of cartilage intermingled with true bone to give added flexiability. This comes at a price, elven bones break easier than human ones though usually they will bend first.

Elves do not weigh and indeed cannot weigh as much as humans – their skeletons would collapse under the weight. Elven muscle tissue is stronger per pound than human muscles, but there is less of it in most individuals adding to their frail look. These highly dense but light muscles take a long time to grow, adding the immature period most elves undergo.

Elves therefore have much more flexiable bodies on average than humans, but at a price of being more easily injured – hence their ability statistic adjustments in the Player’s Handbook.

Reverie: It is well known that elves not only don’t sleep, but can’t. Their minds are always active on some level and they are always aware of their surroundings. However, elves do have to enter a state called the reverie. While in many respects this is an advantage, sometimes it can be a weakness.

During reverie the elven mind accomplishes what the human mind does with sleep – discarding unneeded memories and strengthing those that are desired. However, for an elf this is largely a conscious process.

Elves need to spend at least four hours a day in this state though they can spend more. Elves who fail to reverie the proper amount of time don’t suffer the same kind of fatigue as humans, though the game effects are the same. As the period between reveries increases the elven mind becomes increasingly disoriented until finally it collapses in on itself and the elf enters a coma. These comatose episodes are about the only time an elf experiences unconsciousness and it is frightening to them in the extreme despite the fact that it is in this state that most elven infants linger in on and off until their minds are developed enough to begin to reverie.

Birth & Childhood: Elven females, unlike their human counterparts, are only capacle of becoming pregnant once a year. This phenomena is known as an “eustral cycle” and is seen in deer and other prey animals. Even when the chance of pregnancy is present it is fairly rare – most elves only successfully get pregnant five or six times in their lifetimes. Since elven females need not fear unwanted pregnancies as often they tend to be more promicscuous than human females, and elven society is certainly more tolerant and unstructured where sex is concerned.

When an elf does become pregnant she undergoes a year long pregnancy that delivers up two infants of three to four lbs. In almost all instances one of the infants is stillborn and it isn’t unusual for both to be. Elven infants are born even less developed than human babes with their eyes closed. They will not open their eyes at all until around six months old. They also have no hair at all and lack fingernails and toenails.

The babes must suckle for the first year, their digestive system being unable to handle anything more complicated than mother’s milk. Elven milk isn’t especially nourishing either, but it is reflective of the slow developing process that is the racial achillies heel of elves.

Another elven weakness from a physiological standpoint is that once an elven female has bore a child –successfully or not – it will be some ten to as long as twenty years before she can bear another. During this time her body doesn’t ovulate at all.

Elves take around 24 years to reach physical maturity, and around considered adult until 30 years. Human musing of elves requiring a hundred years to reach adulthood are largely false though elven society doesn’t confer full adult rights to anyone less than a century in age.

Personality: Elves delight in the world around them as they’ve always known it as a culture. Their personalities can be warm, passionate or reserved, but they often give off a feeling of reserve. Elves can live a long, long time, and most aren’t willing to risk that longevity to rash dangerous actions, yet at the same time they speak with their hearts as well as their mind when asked.

Description & Clothing: Frail and thin, elves epitomize beauty to the eyes of many humans. Their clothes are long and flowing, but cut with comfort instead of modesty in mind. Since they aren’t bothered as much by temperatures as humans they tend to dress lightly, and they have no qualms about not dressing at all when among their own kind, though they find that is best to be appear to be modest when dealing with humans.

Elven weaving processes take a long time to perform by tradition, and these items are never rushed. Their fabrics are highly prized and very durable. Elves tend to use forest colors with all their fabrics – be that green in spring and summer, or stark whites for winter and oranges and golds in fall.

Relations: Elves prefer to remain aloof in their dealings with the members of other races. Part of this is again due to the differences in lifespans – individuals of other races don’t live anywhere near long enough to honor what elves would perceive as a long-term commitment. This non-commital stance is very off-putting to Carthasana’s dwarves, though humans don’t like it either. This same attitude actually helps them get along with gnomes and oyasini, each of which tend to want to tinker with things more than elves like.

Marriage & Family: Since elven females do not run a risk of pregnancy for most of the year they have a reputation (largely deserved) of being promiscuous. Despite their long life spans elves rarely enter into long term commitments (although this is a relative thing - a commitment of 40 years is hardly long term to them) as they see it as wearing to their souls. Love is one such aspect that elves hold a much different view upon than humans do - elves do not marry in the human sense, and fathers are never really involved in the lives of their very young children even if they do know which child is theirs. Women raise their children one at a time, a process that takes twenty years. At this point the care of the children is passed from parent to maschadri, which is an elven term roughly equivalent to god parent. It is this individual, who is almost always male and usually the father (or assumed father), that trains the child in whatever art they've chosen. This training in turn tends to last twenty years as well.

Elven families are traced by via matriarchy, though elves do not value long term family heritage in the manner of the other races. They are also aloof and cold when they observe such ties among humans and have no understanding of it whatsoever in the extreme that dwarves take it. The affection afforded between mother and child is extremely strong, though all other bonds are missing. Elves, for their own part, see no problem with this, and tend to explore love (or as observing races put it, lust) in as many ways possible. Indeed, in this one respect elves show no signs of their age. Their love burns hot, but it burns briefly.

Elven Lands: Elven domains are fairly ambiguous in boundary as elves make no attempt to divide the land as other races do. Nor do elves answer to a common elven king (though in their negotiations a local clan leader may say he’s “king” to placate human needs to speak to an authority figure). This lack of a marking on their territories make it possible to enter and leave elven villages and cities, often without even knowing you were there.

Elves dislike artificial and uneccesary changes to the land. Hence elven homes and cities blend into the landscape and wildlife is welcome to move within their villages. Elves do not establish large cities because of the damage such establishments can do to the environment. Several large tracts of apparent wilderness in Carthasana, such as the Calishmere and the Voolrean Forests, are elven nations.

Unlike the elves of other worlds, Carthasanan elves are not especially capacle craftsmen of metals or magical devices. They also prefer magic drawn from the land or from the self and study magic in an introspective pattern as opposed to “book learning” of the art as elves of other worlds do.

Religion: Elven religion is centered around the dichotomy of the Seelie and Unseelie courts. There are five deities in each court and they are held to each rule half the year. Every elf is said to have an unseelie side which must be suppressed Like so many other aspects of elven life, religion is a personal pursuit that each individual must walk for themselves. Elves do not congregate except on the turns of the seasons, and the religious focus of those celebrations tends to be overshadowed by reveling.

Outside of these ceremonies elven priests contemplatively follow the path set before them by life. They make themselves available to council those elves who request it, and they maintain shrines and holy sites for the benefit of their communities, but on the whole religion and religious observance does not dominate elven life in the way it dominates humans.

Language: The elven tongue is more or less uniform throughout the race unlike the human tongues, though it has regional dialects. These dialects can be so contorted that they should be treated as separate languages except that, once written down, they can be read readily.

Elven writing is an artform in and of itself, and it is very important to them. An elf’s memory of event specifics is no better than a human’s, so without writing’s to remind them they’d forget their childhoods and young adulthood by the time they become venerable.

The elven alphabet has 51 letters with three distinct modes for each letter depending on whether it is the first, middle or last letter in the word.

Names: Elves purport to hold little meaning in names and change them frequently. Unlike most races, they rarely have or go by family names – if asked for a last name most will give their mother’s name. Elves, like other races, have a true name, but most elves rarely know their true name having never been told it by their parents.

Adventurers: Elves adventure primarily out of curiousity, or for many of the same reasons as humans do – except that they rarely attempt to amass wealth or property. Most adventuring elves are still fairly young, as elder elves tend to settle down and enjoy finer and more peaceful pursuits.

 

[Michael Morris]

Any comments or shall I move on to dwarves?