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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Lanefan" data-source="post: 9545580" data-attributes="member: 29398">IMO your whole premise is already fatally flawed at this point.  Once a player declares an action then that's it: the character is committed to taking that action.  Step 4 should read "The player (or the DM, if appropriate) rolls, and the game goes on."Agreed, though I'm fine with failure merely maintaining the status quo.Another irrecoverable flaw in the premise is that we're expected to take the bolded as the default state, which I will not do.If there's no passive rolls to spot things then how do you handle the very frequent situation where, when the PCs aren't specifically looking for something or are looking for something else, they may or may not notice something that's not necessarily front-and-centre?  Ultra-basic example: on returning to a previously-explored room they may or may not notice the desk is just slightly out of place from where it was before (in the intervening time someone's come in and quickly searched it) yet it;s highly unlikely the players are going to have their characters re-check the room in case anything has been disturbed.My take on the example: if they think to look for a secret door they'll have the usual odds of finding it if they look in the right place and won't find anything if they look elsewhere.  I won't telegraph it, though; if it's important enough they'll eventually realize on their own that they need to find it and if it's not that important, who cares?Put another way, it's no skin off my-as-DM nose if they never find it even if what's behind it is important to the adventure or story, or is major treasure.  I've seen parties miss 75% or more of the treasure in an adventure, and generally assume they'll always miss some of it - doesn't bother me.Good luck with that, given that by the bolded above you've made it a central issue to your premise.</blockquote>

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