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Message: <blockquote data-quote="El Jefe" data-source="post: 3083118" data-attributes="member: 19990">Um, becuase it's much more complicated than straight D20, a greater quantity of ambiguous rules interpretations present themselves than in D20, the game system has less maturity (shelf life) than D20, and a higher percentage of people here have never gamed with the ruleset before (by definition).  Not everyone needs training wheels, but it makes sense to have them available for those who want them.You're unusual.  I did the same with Avatar, but I'm quickly seeing that he's far from an optimized (powergamed?) M&M character.  And I'm unusual in that respect...I'd bet that I had a much easier time of figuring out how damage works in M&M 2.0 than most people who just pick the book up.  But, this isn't really about the two of us, or even any of the other players out there.  It's about dealing with the rules, and there just isn't and never will be a set of rules that covers every practical situation.  And even if there was, there is still the problem of memorizing (at least well enough to know that a specific rule exists, let alone being able to quote the rule).and interpreting a fairly complicated system of rules.  If I may give a current D20 example?In Ashin's Commission, a LEW game that I've picked up from a GM who is having connection problems and that Rystil Arden is playing in, one of the PCs manifested a spell-like ability.Let us first leave aside the matter of the fact that at the time I assumed that the character in question simply had the spell-like ability in question...since then, I've come to question just how he came by it, and am drawing a blank (not a racial ability, the character is human; not a class ability, being a low-level cleric grants spells, but not spell-like abilities; not a domain ability per the written domain description in the LEW house rules, althought the character in question claims it is, etc.)  But leaving that aside, since my doubt didn't emerge until well into an encounter several rounds after the ability took effect...Just what is the duration of a given spell or spell-like ability in D20?  You'd think that would be so settled that the question wouldn't be worth asking.  The player (and remember, this is an experienced player, and this is his character) claims that if he can speak and concentrate at the same time, then he is concentrating and the spell-like ability is still up.  But, if not, the duration is 3 rounds and has just expired.  The spell description (and we've already established that the spell-like ability works exactly like the spell of the same name) reads duration:  "Concentration, up to 1 round/level" (the PC is 3rd level).  So, the correct answer is, because one can perform a free action (talk) and a standard action (concentrate), the PC is able to concentrate for 3 rounds, but after that the ability is down.Ok, leaving aside that an experienced player running under a well-established ruleset had difficulty with that (and we all have our mental lapses), consider that there is an additional complication.  The player with the spell-like ability is in the middle of the initiative order, and a party member at the top of the order was affected.  Consider the sequence of events:- PC 1 acts, is not affected by the spell-like ability- PC 2 manifests the ability, concentrates to maintain it, and talks- PC 3 is affected by the ability, which determines his actions(second round)- PC 1 is affected by the ability, which determines his actions- PC 2 concentrates and talks- PC 3 is affected by the ability, which determines his actions(third round)- PC 1 is affected by the ability, which determines his actions- PC 2 concentrates and talks- PC 3 is affected by the ability, which determines his actions(fourth round, duration of the spell-like ability has expired)- PC 1 may act freely- PC 2 has to do something else- PC 3 may act freelyNotice that although the duration is for 3 rounds, PC 1 is only affected for 2?  Some GMs would interpret that last round as so:(fourth round)- PC 1 is affected by the ability, which determines his actions- PC 2's spell-like ability expires, so he has to do something else- PC 3 may act freely(fifth round)- PC 1 may act freely (etc.)Now, you'd think that issue (whether a duration expires on a turn boundary, or on a PCs initiative) would be well settled.  But it (apparently) isn't.  I've seen this interpreted both ways in LEW and elsewhere, including one example where it made the difference between a character reaching -10 hp and dying, or being saved at -9 hp.  Nor can I find this in the D20 SRD.My point is, if something that fundamental is either open to interpretation (or if not, has a resolution so obscure to so many players) in a very well-established ruleset that is published online and accessible to a very large user base, shouldn't we be a little mindful of potential rules problems in a newly-revised (within the last 12 months) ruleset that is only accessible to the relatively small number of people who have purchased the rulebooks?Given that, if people want a place to practice, I wouldn't deny them.</blockquote>

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