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Respect Mah Authoritah: Thoughts on DM and Player Authority in 5e
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<blockquote data-quote="overgeeked" data-source="post: 8431663" data-attributes="member: 86653"><p>Wow. The thread really moved overnight. Rather than quote and response to individual posters, here's some thoughts on the topics that have come up and/or still being discussed.</p><p></p><p>Backgrounds aren't magic and players shouldn't expect them to be. They have limits. Even if the wording of the background suggest it's an always on magical power that forces everyone of a particular social standing to <em>do the thing</em>, there will be exceptions, because...again...backgrounds are not magic. Yes, the text of noble seems to imply that every single commoner in the entire world will automatically and without question bow and scrape, but that's not how any reasonable person would expect it to actually function in game. The commoners from different kingdoms might not care about your noble status "back home". The local nobles may be tyrants and so the commoners hate the nobles...all nobles. You might be in disguise (whether intentionally or not). There's a lot of other fictional positioning that matters when it intersects with the fictional positioning granted by the background. So too with Folk Hero and all the rest of the backgrounds that provide fictional positioning. </p><p></p><p>I'm honestly sick to death of PC backstories. I don't remember the last one that was half-way interesting. Every one of them reads like the exploits of a 40th-level character with multiple reincarnations each of which running well beyond the level cap and solidly into epic level character...several times over. Like, if your character did the things listed in the first two paragraphs of your backstory you'd already be 5th level...and there's still 75 pages to go...just stop. And while I like the idea of knives, I'd rather the players just give me a bullet point list of quests and missions and goals they want to work towards in game. If they want to give any of them more detail than "kill a dragon for parts" they can once we all collectively know that's going to actually be a thing that happens in game. </p><p></p><p>Limits of DM authority and dice and fairness. Whether individual player like it or not and whether individual DMs use it or not, the books rather explicitly give carte blanche to the DM. But the rulebooks aren't the only thing that goes into a game of D&D. There's also the social contract. The social contract covers things like fudging die rolls, DM fairness, and letting results stand...the rulebooks don't. Any DM who uses that carte blanche to arbitrarily chance things willy-nilly would quickly find themselves in a room alone wondering where the players went. Rightfully so. Yes, the DM <em>should</em> let the dice fall where they may, but there's nothing in the book that says the DM <em>must</em>. This may seem like a semantic point, but words have meaning. There is a difference between <em>should</em> and <em>must</em>. </p><p></p><p>Railroading vs linear vs sandboxes. To me, railroading is the negation or elimination of player choice...or put another way the elimination of any possibility the DM doesn't expect. That's about the worst DM practice possible...it's barely a step up from "rocks fall, everyone dies". But linear adventures are not necessarily railroads. If the players choose to follow the linear adventure, it's not a railroad. It's only then the DM abuses their authority and prevents the PCs from turning left or right that it becomes a railroad. If the players think of a cool thing to try and for no other reason than to preserve the DM's precious story the DM refuses...that's railroading. To me, that's exactly why I run sandboxes. I absolutely hate railroading. I kinda hate linear adventures, too. But they're not as bad. </p><p></p><p>Plots vs situations. For what it's worth, and as mentioned, a plot is a predetermined sequence of events whereas a situation is a moment of tension, or potential for tension. A plot is: first the PCs <em>will</em> go here, next the PCs <em>will</em> do this, next the PCs <em>will</em> go there. It's a plot because you're assuming what the PCs <em>will</em> do. It becomes a railroad when the DM forces those predetermined choices on the players. A situation is: this interesting thing exists <em>and</em> the PCs know about. There's no presumed choices. It's a hook. The PCs are free to engage with it or not. The PCs are free to handle that hook in any manner they see fit.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="overgeeked, post: 8431663, member: 86653"] Wow. The thread really moved overnight. Rather than quote and response to individual posters, here's some thoughts on the topics that have come up and/or still being discussed. Backgrounds aren't magic and players shouldn't expect them to be. They have limits. Even if the wording of the background suggest it's an always on magical power that forces everyone of a particular social standing to [I]do the thing[/I], there will be exceptions, because...again...backgrounds are not magic. Yes, the text of noble seems to imply that every single commoner in the entire world will automatically and without question bow and scrape, but that's not how any reasonable person would expect it to actually function in game. The commoners from different kingdoms might not care about your noble status "back home". The local nobles may be tyrants and so the commoners hate the nobles...all nobles. You might be in disguise (whether intentionally or not). There's a lot of other fictional positioning that matters when it intersects with the fictional positioning granted by the background. So too with Folk Hero and all the rest of the backgrounds that provide fictional positioning. I'm honestly sick to death of PC backstories. I don't remember the last one that was half-way interesting. Every one of them reads like the exploits of a 40th-level character with multiple reincarnations each of which running well beyond the level cap and solidly into epic level character...several times over. Like, if your character did the things listed in the first two paragraphs of your backstory you'd already be 5th level...and there's still 75 pages to go...just stop. And while I like the idea of knives, I'd rather the players just give me a bullet point list of quests and missions and goals they want to work towards in game. If they want to give any of them more detail than "kill a dragon for parts" they can once we all collectively know that's going to actually be a thing that happens in game. Limits of DM authority and dice and fairness. Whether individual player like it or not and whether individual DMs use it or not, the books rather explicitly give carte blanche to the DM. But the rulebooks aren't the only thing that goes into a game of D&D. There's also the social contract. The social contract covers things like fudging die rolls, DM fairness, and letting results stand...the rulebooks don't. Any DM who uses that carte blanche to arbitrarily chance things willy-nilly would quickly find themselves in a room alone wondering where the players went. Rightfully so. Yes, the DM [I]should[/I] let the dice fall where they may, but there's nothing in the book that says the DM [I]must[/I]. This may seem like a semantic point, but words have meaning. There is a difference between [I]should[/I] and [I]must[/I]. Railroading vs linear vs sandboxes. To me, railroading is the negation or elimination of player choice...or put another way the elimination of any possibility the DM doesn't expect. That's about the worst DM practice possible...it's barely a step up from "rocks fall, everyone dies". But linear adventures are not necessarily railroads. If the players choose to follow the linear adventure, it's not a railroad. It's only then the DM abuses their authority and prevents the PCs from turning left or right that it becomes a railroad. If the players think of a cool thing to try and for no other reason than to preserve the DM's precious story the DM refuses...that's railroading. To me, that's exactly why I run sandboxes. I absolutely hate railroading. I kinda hate linear adventures, too. But they're not as bad. Plots vs situations. For what it's worth, and as mentioned, a plot is a predetermined sequence of events whereas a situation is a moment of tension, or potential for tension. A plot is: first the PCs [I]will[/I] go here, next the PCs [I]will[/I] do this, next the PCs [I]will[/I] go there. It's a plot because you're assuming what the PCs [I]will[/I] do. It becomes a railroad when the DM forces those predetermined choices on the players. A situation is: this interesting thing exists [I]and[/I] the PCs know about. There's no presumed choices. It's a hook. The PCs are free to engage with it or not. The PCs are free to handle that hook in any manner they see fit. [/QUOTE]
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