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Message: <blockquote data-quote="overgeeked" data-source="post: 8433123" data-attributes="member: 86653">No, it's you misunderstanding game theory. Within the abstract infinite game there are smaller finite games. You keep pointing to the finite games within the infinite and are claiming there are win conditions to the infinite game. This is wrong. You absolutely can win a combat, a quest, or a mission. You cannot win "a game of D&D". There is no end to "a game of D&D" unless the players and DM decide to stop playing. There's always another quest, another mission, another fight, another monster, another prisoner to rescue. There's no time limit. A single session of D&D might only take a few minutes or a few hours, sure. But that's not codified in the rules. There's no set win conditions in the core three books. Because D&D isn't a finite game, it's an infinite game.How many points is fun worth and how many fun-points do we have to accumulate before the game is over? How do we determine which player won and which player lost? Do we compare their fun-points?Again, mistaking the finite game for the infinite game. Curse of Strahd is a module. It's a pre-packaged finite game you can play within the infinite game of D&D. You can play D&D with the same characters you use in CoS before that module and after that module, as long as they survive. You can lose CoS by dying or failing to defeat Strahd. Because it's a finite game nested in the infinite game of D&D. There are no win conditions listed in the core three. Think of it like this. The rules of hockey tell me how long the game lasts and how each player and team scores points and provides rules on how points are tallied, how ties are handled, and who wins at the end of the game. So "hockey" is an abstract, sure. But the abstract rules of the game define what it is to play and how it is you win. That the rules define the time limits and win conditions is what makes it a finite game. But then look at the game rules for D&D. Not a module. The core three. Now, point out where those books list how you win the game. You can't. The best you can come up with will be something vague about having fun and being entertained. Because there are no win conditions for playing D&D. Your character within the game succeeds at a task or a fight or a quest. But you the player don't win or lose. You just play. The point of finite games is to win. The point of infinite games is to continue playing.</blockquote>

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