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Respect Mah Authoritah: Thoughts on DM and Player Authority in 5e
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<blockquote data-quote="Ovinomancer" data-source="post: 8433486" data-attributes="member: 16814"><p>That's a tad hostile, don't you think? No, because the game doesn't do anything without a conflict to resolve. The rules just sit there, the play loop has no purpose... there's nothing. Once you introduce a conflict, you've introduced goals, and that's the same thing as win conditions.</p><p></p><p>I'm perfectly open to you explaining how you play an RPG without any conflicts whatsoever, so please enlighten me if you think I've missed something obvious.</p><p></p><p>I didn't say combat, I said conflict.</p><p></p><p>I didn't say they had simple win conditions. They can, and often do, have multiple such simple win conditions -- succeed at this task, win this combat, survive this effect, etc. They can also have complex win conditions, save the world, redeem my family honor, secure the throne for the exiled prince, etc. RPGs are usually about layered win conditions, that cycle and repeat and iterate. What doesn't happen, ever, is an absence of them.</p><p></p><p>I did finish a win condition in your example. The issue of the Evil Duke is completed A new one has arisen. Now this one will succeed, fail, or be abandoned. At some point, the game will finish, and we can look back and take score. It won't be a number, but it's still taking score -- "man, that was a great game, remember when.....!"</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Ovinomancer, post: 8433486, member: 16814"] That's a tad hostile, don't you think? No, because the game doesn't do anything without a conflict to resolve. The rules just sit there, the play loop has no purpose... there's nothing. Once you introduce a conflict, you've introduced goals, and that's the same thing as win conditions. I'm perfectly open to you explaining how you play an RPG without any conflicts whatsoever, so please enlighten me if you think I've missed something obvious. I didn't say combat, I said conflict. I didn't say they had simple win conditions. They can, and often do, have multiple such simple win conditions -- succeed at this task, win this combat, survive this effect, etc. They can also have complex win conditions, save the world, redeem my family honor, secure the throne for the exiled prince, etc. RPGs are usually about layered win conditions, that cycle and repeat and iterate. What doesn't happen, ever, is an absence of them. I did finish a win condition in your example. The issue of the Evil Duke is completed A new one has arisen. Now this one will succeed, fail, or be abandoned. At some point, the game will finish, and we can look back and take score. It won't be a number, but it's still taking score -- "man, that was a great game, remember when.....!" [/QUOTE]
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Respect Mah Authoritah: Thoughts on DM and Player Authority in 5e
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