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Respect Mah Authoritah: Thoughts on DM and Player Authority in 5e
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<blockquote data-quote="Ovinomancer" data-source="post: 8434032" data-attributes="member: 16814"><p>This is confused in that you're insisting that for a "win" to occur, it must be defined explicitly within the rules of the game and also explicitly scored. This couldn't be further from the truth. There are any number of games that I've played where I have an objective outside the rules of the game that defines winning for me. A great example is my old Battletech crew, where I had a win condition of "Chuck's mechs don't leave the board." Chuck is a real person, and that's his real name, btw -- this is a straight up example. I could absolutely lose whatever objective of a given game might be, but if none of Chuck's mechs survived, that was a win for me, straight up, unscored, did my job well. Even if Chuck was on my side. (For the record, we're good friends, and this wasn't ever a point of contention between us -- you'd have to know us together to understand.)</p><p></p><p>So, in a Battletech game that included Chuck, I had a clear, unambiguous Win Condition that was entirely undefined by the game, yet was prosecuted from within the ambit of the game's rules. There was no score needed here -- I did it or I did not. So, here's a clear example that shows your argument to be false. I could present numerous others, but it's not necessary.</p><p></p><p>Again, [USER=86653]@overgeeked[/USER], I ask for the game theory you're references for infinite and finite games. My searching has only turned up one source, which isn't really about game theory, written by a theologian, and is more about how life is the only infinite game. There's interesting stuff there, but it's not related to your claims very well at all. What source are you using? I am very curious.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Ovinomancer, post: 8434032, member: 16814"] This is confused in that you're insisting that for a "win" to occur, it must be defined explicitly within the rules of the game and also explicitly scored. This couldn't be further from the truth. There are any number of games that I've played where I have an objective outside the rules of the game that defines winning for me. A great example is my old Battletech crew, where I had a win condition of "Chuck's mechs don't leave the board." Chuck is a real person, and that's his real name, btw -- this is a straight up example. I could absolutely lose whatever objective of a given game might be, but if none of Chuck's mechs survived, that was a win for me, straight up, unscored, did my job well. Even if Chuck was on my side. (For the record, we're good friends, and this wasn't ever a point of contention between us -- you'd have to know us together to understand.) So, in a Battletech game that included Chuck, I had a clear, unambiguous Win Condition that was entirely undefined by the game, yet was prosecuted from within the ambit of the game's rules. There was no score needed here -- I did it or I did not. So, here's a clear example that shows your argument to be false. I could present numerous others, but it's not necessary. Again, [USER=86653]@overgeeked[/USER], I ask for the game theory you're references for infinite and finite games. My searching has only turned up one source, which isn't really about game theory, written by a theologian, and is more about how life is the only infinite game. There's interesting stuff there, but it's not related to your claims very well at all. What source are you using? I am very curious. [/QUOTE]
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