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Respect Mah Authoritah: Thoughts on DM and Player Authority in 5e
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<blockquote data-quote="hawkeyefan" data-source="post: 8445090" data-attributes="member: 6785785"><p>That's a reasonable take. I don't quite agree because There was nothing established that the ranger didn't have line of sight. In fact, I had shot the hag in the previous round. She then dived into the water (which had been established as being about hip deep in most areas) and we were told we could see her swimming away with surprising speed (indicating to us that she had a swim speed). </p><p></p><p>In looking at the rules as they relate to underwater combat (not precise rules for this occasion, but likely the closest rules we have) it indicates that ranged attacks have disadvantage unless they're spear-like or crossbows. So I think disadvantage would have been a better way to handle it rather than simply denying the attack can take place.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>When I say it undermined rules, I mean that it seems there are more rules that support the opposite ruling. I agree that it doesn't explicitly violate any rules, and of course there's always the "rule zero" nonsense that could be invoked. However, I don't really see the need for the ruling to not allow the attack? What's the purpose of it? It seems to preserve this hag for a later encounter. Which to me, puts the NPC above the PC, which to me is something to be avoided. </p><p></p><p>Now, having said that, this was a moment of dissatisfaction with how things went, but I didn't flip the table or call shenanigans or anything like that. I wish it had gone otherwise, but it's not a big deal in the grand scheme. It's 5e, I expect this kind of ruling to happen.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Yeah, cover came up as well, but I pointed out that the Sharpshooter feat allows me to ignore all but full cover, and since we can see the Hag as she's swimming away, full cover doesn't seem to apply. The area overall had been described as relatively clear, with the witches' hut being a kind of treehouse up in a small copse of trees in the center of the clearing. </p><p></p><p>I don't see any reason to deny the attack other than to preserve the hag's life. I'll talk to him about it, and see what he says and share it here once I know.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="hawkeyefan, post: 8445090, member: 6785785"] That's a reasonable take. I don't quite agree because There was nothing established that the ranger didn't have line of sight. In fact, I had shot the hag in the previous round. She then dived into the water (which had been established as being about hip deep in most areas) and we were told we could see her swimming away with surprising speed (indicating to us that she had a swim speed). In looking at the rules as they relate to underwater combat (not precise rules for this occasion, but likely the closest rules we have) it indicates that ranged attacks have disadvantage unless they're spear-like or crossbows. So I think disadvantage would have been a better way to handle it rather than simply denying the attack can take place. When I say it undermined rules, I mean that it seems there are more rules that support the opposite ruling. I agree that it doesn't explicitly violate any rules, and of course there's always the "rule zero" nonsense that could be invoked. However, I don't really see the need for the ruling to not allow the attack? What's the purpose of it? It seems to preserve this hag for a later encounter. Which to me, puts the NPC above the PC, which to me is something to be avoided. Now, having said that, this was a moment of dissatisfaction with how things went, but I didn't flip the table or call shenanigans or anything like that. I wish it had gone otherwise, but it's not a big deal in the grand scheme. It's 5e, I expect this kind of ruling to happen. Yeah, cover came up as well, but I pointed out that the Sharpshooter feat allows me to ignore all but full cover, and since we can see the Hag as she's swimming away, full cover doesn't seem to apply. The area overall had been described as relatively clear, with the witches' hut being a kind of treehouse up in a small copse of trees in the center of the clearing. I don't see any reason to deny the attack other than to preserve the hag's life. I'll talk to him about it, and see what he says and share it here once I know. [/QUOTE]
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