Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
White Dwarf Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Nest
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
EN Publishing
Twitter
BlueSky
Facebook
Instagram
EN World
BlueSky
YouTube
Facebook
Twitter
Twitch
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*TTRPGs General
Retcon the dumb "Faction War" and bring back the FULL on Blood War?
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="Alzrius" data-source="post: 5170152" data-attributes="member: 8461"><p>That's a meta-game construct far more than an in-game cosmological principle.</p><p></p><p>The game is written in terms of having a focus on the mortal world because that's what most gamers are inherently familiar with, and will want to play in. A medieval-fantasy world is the standard, and is present in most high fantasy media, from Lord of the Rings to Final Fantasy, and so the game is naturally constructed to appeal to that type of setting and play-style.</p><p></p><p>That's in no way an indicator that the mortal plane is the most important plane, with all of the existing primarily in terms of how they (and their inhabitants) relate to it.</p><p></p><p>There are some in-game indicators of the mortal realm's importance in the overall planar structure, certainly. Gods require worship for sustenance, and so have machinations among mortals. The flow of souls goes to the Outer Planes from the Prime (though, as Shemmy noted, they don't originate from there, but rather "ripen" there). But neither of those things explains why fiends should have any greater desire to torment mortals than, say, angels, or for that matter, each other.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Well clearly that's not true, or Planescape wouldn't have been as successful as it was.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>That's your opinion, and we'll just have to agree to disagree on that one.</p><p></p><p>I can understand where you're coming from with the idea that fiends should be evil to the exclusion of all other "humanizing" factors, but I find that to be limiting, both in-game and out-of-game.</p><p></p><p>It's limiting in-game because it naturally reduces the roles you can have fiends play. They're locked into a single mindset (with minor variations for, say, alignment, or particular fiend type, such as succubus-evil versus balor-evil), and so lose a great deal of individual identity and motivation. I think that quickly makes them cardboard cutouts, which isn't what I want my monsters to be.</p><p></p><p>It's limiting out-of-game because, given that we humans are the ones playing it, trying to adequately portray a truly non-human mindset is very difficult at best. Maybe this says more about me than the point I'm trying to make, but I don't think I could adequately impress upon my players what it means to have a creature who, for all its power, intelligence, and eternal life -to say nothing of being able to access the wider cosmos - is content to keep doing the same thing over and over on such a small scale.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Alzrius, post: 5170152, member: 8461"] That's a meta-game construct far more than an in-game cosmological principle. The game is written in terms of having a focus on the mortal world because that's what most gamers are inherently familiar with, and will want to play in. A medieval-fantasy world is the standard, and is present in most high fantasy media, from Lord of the Rings to Final Fantasy, and so the game is naturally constructed to appeal to that type of setting and play-style. That's in no way an indicator that the mortal plane is the most important plane, with all of the existing primarily in terms of how they (and their inhabitants) relate to it. There are some in-game indicators of the mortal realm's importance in the overall planar structure, certainly. Gods require worship for sustenance, and so have machinations among mortals. The flow of souls goes to the Outer Planes from the Prime (though, as Shemmy noted, they don't originate from there, but rather "ripen" there). But neither of those things explains why fiends should have any greater desire to torment mortals than, say, angels, or for that matter, each other. Well clearly that's not true, or Planescape wouldn't have been as successful as it was. That's your opinion, and we'll just have to agree to disagree on that one. I can understand where you're coming from with the idea that fiends should be evil to the exclusion of all other "humanizing" factors, but I find that to be limiting, both in-game and out-of-game. It's limiting in-game because it naturally reduces the roles you can have fiends play. They're locked into a single mindset (with minor variations for, say, alignment, or particular fiend type, such as succubus-evil versus balor-evil), and so lose a great deal of individual identity and motivation. I think that quickly makes them cardboard cutouts, which isn't what I want my monsters to be. It's limiting out-of-game because, given that we humans are the ones playing it, trying to adequately portray a truly non-human mindset is very difficult at best. Maybe this says more about me than the point I'm trying to make, but I don't think I could adequately impress upon my players what it means to have a creature who, for all its power, intelligence, and eternal life -to say nothing of being able to access the wider cosmos - is content to keep doing the same thing over and over on such a small scale. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*TTRPGs General
Retcon the dumb "Faction War" and bring back the FULL on Blood War?
Top