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<blockquote data-quote="Hussar" data-source="post: 5123628" data-attributes="member: 22779"><p>Fair enough. But, we're talking about two different things. You're talking about a given DM. I'm talking about game designers.</p><p> </p><p></p><p></p><p>Actually the AP's presumed all sorts of things that the party would have. They certainly presumed that the players, just as an example, would have Profession Sailor in the Savage Tide AP. Granted, they did provide an NPC who could do it in a pinch for one adventure, but the presumption was certainly there that the PC's would be running the ship, which is used in many of the adventures.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Meh, not so much. Jack of All Trades in D&D usually means their abilities are so low, that any challenge that would challenges a specialist would blow a generalist out of the water. So, unless you mean adjusting down, I don't think it applies.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Without knowing the exact specifics, I cannot comment on your high level adventure, but, presuming a fly spell is a far cry from presuming psionics IMO. While your group may not have access, I don't design for your group. I think designers should design to the middle, which means that most groups likely will have access to common, PHB spells by a reasonable level.</p><p> </p><p></p><p></p><p>I've yet to see a book of mundane gear that didn't give mechanical bonuses for said gear. Because, if it has no mechanical effect, then you don't need a book for it at all. </p><p></p><p>However, you're insisting on comparing apples to oranges. If you include something which gives mechanical benefits in a core supplement, then every subsequent publication HAS to presume that those will be used, otherwise, balance goes straight out the window.</p><p></p><p>In other words, a designer for 3e should presume that a 7th level party will have some magical equipment and access to 3rd level spells. Otherwise, the challenges he puts in the adventure become tissue paper as the well prepared group blows through them.</p><p></p><p>This is precisely why Paizo Dungeon adventures were so lethal. They presumed that the party was maxed out to a very large degree. Otherwise, they'd be too easy.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Hussar, post: 5123628, member: 22779"] Fair enough. But, we're talking about two different things. You're talking about a given DM. I'm talking about game designers. Actually the AP's presumed all sorts of things that the party would have. They certainly presumed that the players, just as an example, would have Profession Sailor in the Savage Tide AP. Granted, they did provide an NPC who could do it in a pinch for one adventure, but the presumption was certainly there that the PC's would be running the ship, which is used in many of the adventures. Meh, not so much. Jack of All Trades in D&D usually means their abilities are so low, that any challenge that would challenges a specialist would blow a generalist out of the water. So, unless you mean adjusting down, I don't think it applies. Without knowing the exact specifics, I cannot comment on your high level adventure, but, presuming a fly spell is a far cry from presuming psionics IMO. While your group may not have access, I don't design for your group. I think designers should design to the middle, which means that most groups likely will have access to common, PHB spells by a reasonable level. I've yet to see a book of mundane gear that didn't give mechanical bonuses for said gear. Because, if it has no mechanical effect, then you don't need a book for it at all. However, you're insisting on comparing apples to oranges. If you include something which gives mechanical benefits in a core supplement, then every subsequent publication HAS to presume that those will be used, otherwise, balance goes straight out the window. In other words, a designer for 3e should presume that a 7th level party will have some magical equipment and access to 3rd level spells. Otherwise, the challenges he puts in the adventure become tissue paper as the well prepared group blows through them. This is precisely why Paizo Dungeon adventures were so lethal. They presumed that the party was maxed out to a very large degree. Otherwise, they'd be too easy. [/QUOTE]
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