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<blockquote data-quote="Li Shenron" data-source="post: 6052432" data-attributes="member: 1465"><p>We're roughly half a year into the playtesting process, with a bunch of rules packets and a couple of additions released.</p><p></p><p>I have the not-so-comfortable feeling sometimes from what I see in packets or weekly WotC articles, that the designers are not always keeping their original design goals, both general and specific, in mind or literally printed in front of them all the time while doing design work... Of course design goals can change or adapt, but that's not my point here. </p><p></p><p>My point and question to you is: <u>how do you feel WotC is currently keeping up with the design goals that they have setup for themselves?</u></p><p></p><p>Here's a link to their original kick-off design goals list: <a href="http://wizards.com/dnd/Article.aspx?x=dnd/4ll/20120409" target="_blank">http://wizards.com/dnd/Article.aspx?x=dnd/4ll/20120409</a></p><p></p><p>And here some spare info on design goals from designer's interviews: <a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/showwiki.php?title=D+and+D+Next:+General+Information#Design+Goals" target="_blank">http://www.enworld.org/forum/showwiki.php?title=D+and+D+Next:+General+Information#Design+Goals</a></p><p></p><p>Some snippets from various sections in 5e early info on ENWorld (copied here since they're scattered around in the whole wiki):</p><p></p><p>[sblock]<em>"However, we want alignment to be a tool, not a straightjacket, so the execution of those mechanics should serve that goal, and really only apply when dealing with the powerful, elemental forces of alignments, not someone who just behaves a certain way. Additionally, I believe we'll also want it to be easy for a DM to strip those mechanics out of his or her campaign, if the DM so chooses."</em></p><p><em></em></p><p><em>"In general, we want to make sure that everyone has a baseline level of competence in all three pillars of play (combat, interaction, and exploration)."</em></p><p><em></em></p><p><em>"Our primary goal is to produce a rules set that speaks to every incarnation of D&D. So if you are a diehard BECMI/Rules Cyclopedia enthusiast or have embraced 4th edition, loved 2nd edition, 3rd edition, or never moved on from 1st edition, we’re creating this game for you. Imagine a game where you can play the version of D&D you love best. And then imagine everyone plays at the same table, in the same adventure. We aim to make a universal game system that lets you play the game in whatever way, whatever style, with whatever focus you want, whether you want to kick down doors and kill monsters, engage in high intrigue, intense roleplaying, or simply to immerse yourself in a shared world. We’re creating a game where the mechanics can be as complex or as light as you want them. We’re creating the game you want to play."</em></p><p><em></em></p><p><em>Monsters: "What I can say about this goal that Monte is talking about is that we're working to provide the DM with really good world building tools. And it's important to provide information about the orcs place in D&D while making sure that a Monster remains relevant as the characters level up. They're might be an orc shaman, an orc champion or whatever for higher levels, but we also want the basic orc to be relevant at higher levels. We want it to be really easy for the DM to open the Monster Manual and drop an orc or iconic monsters into the game."</em></p><p><em></em></p><p><em>"While many DMs want to build monsters using the target numbers-based system that 4th edition uses, some DMs may want to build their monsters like PCs, adding levels of cleric onto orcs to create enemies that also have many class features. Some DMs may want to use templates to create everything from a fiendish hobgoblin to a vampiric half-celestial animated chair. So we'll need to find ways to support those needs, without mandating them."</em></p><p><em></em></p><p><em>"In general, I think that monsters should do what fans of D&D lore expect them to do, and if that means being really scary mechanically then so be it. I think there's room in the game for monsters that simply are more dangerous and deadly than others, just as I think there's room in the game for monsters whose purpose is to be interacted with, not fought. I also think it's good for monsters to exist that you don't want to face in a straight-up fight, but that you need to be prepared for or figure out a clever way to outwit rather than going in spells a-blazin'."</em></p><p><em></em></p><p><em>Crafting: "The goal is to make sure the rules for crafting things are present, and that you can opt into being a craftsman if you want as a player, but that doing so doesn't consume a significant portion of the resources you need for adventuring. We've tinkered with putting it in themes, for example, as a benefit that you just get."</em></p><p><em></em></p><p><em>"For movement and positioning, the goal is to focus more on terrain and interesting things to move to and around, rather than flanking and such."</em></p><p><em></em></p><p><em>"... we can offer lots of options to create the kinds of games that any individual DM and his or her players want to play. Want to run a game where players are always healed up to full hit points between fights? No problem; we’ve got rules for that. Want to run a game that is super-deadly with disposable characters? We can do that too, just by tweaking things like hit points, availability of self healing, and so forth."</em></p><p><em></em></p><p><em>"... our goal of making combat move faster across all levels, being easier to teach to new players, and also making sure that the kinds of effects we're putting into the game are big, meaty and significant so that you really feel their impact."</em></p><p><em></em></p><p><em>"The goal is to remove mechanics from alignment. It's a key part of the world, but not the rules or spells."</em></p><p><em></em></p><p><em>"One of the key hang ups we have with healing is trying to find a way to make the cleric optional. So, we're definitely aiming to make it so that you can remove classes, races, or entire types of magic without screwing up the game's balance. I think restricting that sort of thing is one of the ways that DMs like to make unique campaigns, so we want to allow for that."</em></p><p><em></em></p><p><em>"The XP system is the kind of thing where I want to do a few different systems and have the DM pick one (XP for treasure, XP for killing, XP for meeting story goals, etc) to establish the tone for his or her campaign."</em></p><p><em></em></p><p><em>"We definitely want the classes to be balanced, though having things exactly mathematically balanced isn't always the goal. If the fighter is 100% damage for example, then maybe this other class is 80% damage/combat and 20% exploration."</em></p><p><em></em></p><p><em>"What we're really getting at is that character creation should take as long as you want. If you want to jump into a game quickly, you can put together an easy character and not worry about too many of those options. But if you want to build the more complex character and go through the options and tweak it to be exactly what you want, then you have the time and options for that."</em></p><p><em></em></p><p><em></em>[/sblock]</p><p></p><p>And finally some links to the design goals of specific classes:</p><p></p><p><a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/showwiki.php?title=D+and+D+Next:+Classes#Fighter+Design+Goals" target="_blank">http://www.enworld.org/forum/showwiki.php?title=D+and+D+Next:+Classes#Fighter+Design+Goals</a></p><p><a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/showwiki.php?title=D+and+D+Next:+Classes#Cleric+Design+Goals" target="_blank">http://www.enworld.org/forum/showwiki.php?title=D+and+D+Next:+Classes#Cleric+Design+Goals</a></p><p><a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/showwiki.php?title=D+and+D+Next:+Classes#Wizard+Design+Goals" target="_blank">http://www.enworld.org/forum/showwiki.php?title=D+and+D+Next:+Classes#Wizard+Design+Goals</a></p><p><a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/showwiki.php?title=D+and+D+Next:+Classes#Rogue+Design+Goals" target="_blank">http://www.enworld.org/forum/showwiki.php?title=D+and+D+Next:+Classes#Rogue+Design+Goals</a></p><p><a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/showwiki.php?title=D+and+D+Next:+Classes#Paladin+Design+Goals" target="_blank">http://www.enworld.org/forum/showwiki.php?title=D+and+D+Next:+Classes#Paladin+Design+Goals</a></p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Li Shenron, post: 6052432, member: 1465"] We're roughly half a year into the playtesting process, with a bunch of rules packets and a couple of additions released. I have the not-so-comfortable feeling sometimes from what I see in packets or weekly WotC articles, that the designers are not always keeping their original design goals, both general and specific, in mind or literally printed in front of them all the time while doing design work... Of course design goals can change or adapt, but that's not my point here. My point and question to you is: [U]how do you feel WotC is currently keeping up with the design goals that they have setup for themselves?[/U] Here's a link to their original kick-off design goals list: [url]http://wizards.com/dnd/Article.aspx?x=dnd/4ll/20120409[/url] And here some spare info on design goals from designer's interviews: [url]http://www.enworld.org/forum/showwiki.php?title=D+and+D+Next:+General+Information#Design+Goals[/url] Some snippets from various sections in 5e early info on ENWorld (copied here since they're scattered around in the whole wiki): [sblock][I]"However, we want alignment to be a tool, not a straightjacket, so the execution of those mechanics should serve that goal, and really only apply when dealing with the powerful, elemental forces of alignments, not someone who just behaves a certain way. Additionally, I believe we'll also want it to be easy for a DM to strip those mechanics out of his or her campaign, if the DM so chooses." "In general, we want to make sure that everyone has a baseline level of competence in all three pillars of play (combat, interaction, and exploration)." "Our primary goal is to produce a rules set that speaks to every incarnation of D&D. So if you are a diehard BECMI/Rules Cyclopedia enthusiast or have embraced 4th edition, loved 2nd edition, 3rd edition, or never moved on from 1st edition, we’re creating this game for you. Imagine a game where you can play the version of D&D you love best. And then imagine everyone plays at the same table, in the same adventure. We aim to make a universal game system that lets you play the game in whatever way, whatever style, with whatever focus you want, whether you want to kick down doors and kill monsters, engage in high intrigue, intense roleplaying, or simply to immerse yourself in a shared world. We’re creating a game where the mechanics can be as complex or as light as you want them. We’re creating the game you want to play." Monsters: "What I can say about this goal that Monte is talking about is that we're working to provide the DM with really good world building tools. And it's important to provide information about the orcs place in D&D while making sure that a Monster remains relevant as the characters level up. They're might be an orc shaman, an orc champion or whatever for higher levels, but we also want the basic orc to be relevant at higher levels. We want it to be really easy for the DM to open the Monster Manual and drop an orc or iconic monsters into the game." "While many DMs want to build monsters using the target numbers-based system that 4th edition uses, some DMs may want to build their monsters like PCs, adding levels of cleric onto orcs to create enemies that also have many class features. Some DMs may want to use templates to create everything from a fiendish hobgoblin to a vampiric half-celestial animated chair. So we'll need to find ways to support those needs, without mandating them." "In general, I think that monsters should do what fans of D&D lore expect them to do, and if that means being really scary mechanically then so be it. I think there's room in the game for monsters that simply are more dangerous and deadly than others, just as I think there's room in the game for monsters whose purpose is to be interacted with, not fought. I also think it's good for monsters to exist that you don't want to face in a straight-up fight, but that you need to be prepared for or figure out a clever way to outwit rather than going in spells a-blazin'." Crafting: "The goal is to make sure the rules for crafting things are present, and that you can opt into being a craftsman if you want as a player, but that doing so doesn't consume a significant portion of the resources you need for adventuring. We've tinkered with putting it in themes, for example, as a benefit that you just get." "For movement and positioning, the goal is to focus more on terrain and interesting things to move to and around, rather than flanking and such." "... we can offer lots of options to create the kinds of games that any individual DM and his or her players want to play. Want to run a game where players are always healed up to full hit points between fights? No problem; we’ve got rules for that. Want to run a game that is super-deadly with disposable characters? We can do that too, just by tweaking things like hit points, availability of self healing, and so forth." "... our goal of making combat move faster across all levels, being easier to teach to new players, and also making sure that the kinds of effects we're putting into the game are big, meaty and significant so that you really feel their impact." "The goal is to remove mechanics from alignment. It's a key part of the world, but not the rules or spells." "One of the key hang ups we have with healing is trying to find a way to make the cleric optional. So, we're definitely aiming to make it so that you can remove classes, races, or entire types of magic without screwing up the game's balance. I think restricting that sort of thing is one of the ways that DMs like to make unique campaigns, so we want to allow for that." "The XP system is the kind of thing where I want to do a few different systems and have the DM pick one (XP for treasure, XP for killing, XP for meeting story goals, etc) to establish the tone for his or her campaign." "We definitely want the classes to be balanced, though having things exactly mathematically balanced isn't always the goal. If the fighter is 100% damage for example, then maybe this other class is 80% damage/combat and 20% exploration." "What we're really getting at is that character creation should take as long as you want. If you want to jump into a game quickly, you can put together an easy character and not worry about too many of those options. But if you want to build the more complex character and go through the options and tweak it to be exactly what you want, then you have the time and options for that." [/I][/sblock] And finally some links to the design goals of specific classes: [url]http://www.enworld.org/forum/showwiki.php?title=D+and+D+Next:+Classes#Fighter+Design+Goals[/url] [url]http://www.enworld.org/forum/showwiki.php?title=D+and+D+Next:+Classes#Cleric+Design+Goals[/url] [url]http://www.enworld.org/forum/showwiki.php?title=D+and+D+Next:+Classes#Wizard+Design+Goals[/url] [url]http://www.enworld.org/forum/showwiki.php?title=D+and+D+Next:+Classes#Rogue+Design+Goals[/url] [url]http://www.enworld.org/forum/showwiki.php?title=D+and+D+Next:+Classes#Paladin+Design+Goals[/url] [/QUOTE]
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