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<blockquote data-quote="Lanefan" data-source="post: 7484727" data-attributes="member: 29398">So if they're taking out major dragons at 4th-8th level what do they take on at 10th level?&nbsp; 12th?&nbsp; 15th?I don't want them going around killing deities - giving deities stats so they can be killed as was done in Deities and Demigods is a flat-out dumb idea - and going into the evil planes and slaying demons and devils only holds appeal for so long.If the dragon is to be the iconic monster of the game then it needs to be just that: iconic.&nbsp; And, at the high end, badder-ass than all the other monsters out there...and glass cannons don't qualify.Sure a party can kill little dragons or even medium dragons here and there throughout their adventuring careers, but the really big ones kinda want to be the thing you spend the whole campaign working up to; where a carefully planned attack is likely to only weaken it quickly and you still have to finish it off only it's very angry and wants to (and can) kill you dead.Divorce breath-weapon damage from the dragon's hit point total (dumb idea to lock them together in the first place!), give the dragon a boatload more hit points - at least double - and give it its strength bonuses to melee hit and damage.&nbsp; Then let 'er rip against the best PCs your game can produce.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Lanefan, post: 7484727, member: 29398"] So if they're taking out major dragons at 4th-8th level what do they take on at 10th level? 12th? 15th? I don't want them going around killing deities - giving deities stats so they can be killed as was done in Deities and Demigods is a flat-out dumb idea - and going into the evil planes and slaying demons and devils only holds appeal for so long. If the dragon is to be the iconic monster of the game then it needs to be just that: iconic. And, at the high end, badder-ass than all the other monsters out there...and glass cannons don't qualify. Sure a party can kill little dragons or even medium dragons here and there throughout their adventuring careers, but the really big ones kinda want to be the thing you spend the whole campaign working up to; where a carefully planned attack is likely to only weaken it quickly and you still have to finish it off only it's very angry and wants to (and can) kill you dead. Divorce breath-weapon damage from the dragon's hit point total (dumb idea to lock them together in the first place!), give the dragon a boatload more hit points - at least double - and give it its strength bonuses to melee hit and damage. Then let 'er rip against the best PCs your game can produce. [/QUOTE]

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