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<blockquote data-quote="Chaosmancer" data-source="post: 7483109" data-attributes="member: 6801228"><p>Those also cover far more than any other Fighting Style. It sounds closer to half of a feat. </p><p></p><p>Also, if the Ranger is fine, why would they release this, since it is clearly only useful for the Beastmaster Ranger and no one else? </p><p></p><p>Then we get into the issue of choosing the fighting style before you actually get the Beast, meaning that you are essentially losing half of your second level to your third level choice. Unless we add in that the Beastmaster can choose a second style later on, which rewrites the class, which we are avoiding. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Longer duration and lower level doesn't fully change the fact that rangers only get a VERY limited pool of spells. I mean, between levels 3 and 5 we get 3 and then 4 spells known. Adding a single spell that a Beastmaster will feel required to take will mean they are losing out on a 1/3 of their spell choices otherwise. </p><p></p><p>And, to make them both usefully powerful and not stolen by either Druids or Bards dipping, they need to be specific to Rangers and Ranger Animal Companions, which would again be a very strange choice for the company to make if the class does not need any assistance. </p><p></p><p>And if it needs assistance, why abandon the rewrite? A stealth rewrite is still a rewrite after all. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>So, yet again, the subclass does not do what people would want it to do. But, she had fun playing the class and essentially ignoring her subclass so the subclass is fine?</p><p></p><p>And if they expected players to play with a conveyor belt of disposable bodies... then I'd say they're holding onto a style of DnD that hasn't been mainstream in over 20 years. That is a massive disconnect with the intended audience, but now more people are more comfortable ignoring their abilities so it is fine? </p><p></p><p></p><p>Honestly, your logic (if it gets taken and applied to all new content) brings into questions why we even have rules. If we don't need strong rules and well-balanced classes to have fun, then why do we bother having them? Because it provides a good support structure. Just because some people are having fun without those supports does not mean we shouldn't work to make sure those supports are included. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Let us not overstate things here. Millions of new people did not add "millions of new approaches to playing the game". We've had millions of players before over the lifetime of Dungeons and Dragons, and we still have only a handful of game playing approaches. I think the biggest number I've ever seen is like "13 player types" or something like that. </p><p></p><p>People have not revolutionized roleplaying games that much, that isn't how entertainment works.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Chaosmancer, post: 7483109, member: 6801228"] Those also cover far more than any other Fighting Style. It sounds closer to half of a feat. Also, if the Ranger is fine, why would they release this, since it is clearly only useful for the Beastmaster Ranger and no one else? Then we get into the issue of choosing the fighting style before you actually get the Beast, meaning that you are essentially losing half of your second level to your third level choice. Unless we add in that the Beastmaster can choose a second style later on, which rewrites the class, which we are avoiding. Longer duration and lower level doesn't fully change the fact that rangers only get a VERY limited pool of spells. I mean, between levels 3 and 5 we get 3 and then 4 spells known. Adding a single spell that a Beastmaster will feel required to take will mean they are losing out on a 1/3 of their spell choices otherwise. And, to make them both usefully powerful and not stolen by either Druids or Bards dipping, they need to be specific to Rangers and Ranger Animal Companions, which would again be a very strange choice for the company to make if the class does not need any assistance. And if it needs assistance, why abandon the rewrite? A stealth rewrite is still a rewrite after all. So, yet again, the subclass does not do what people would want it to do. But, she had fun playing the class and essentially ignoring her subclass so the subclass is fine? And if they expected players to play with a conveyor belt of disposable bodies... then I'd say they're holding onto a style of DnD that hasn't been mainstream in over 20 years. That is a massive disconnect with the intended audience, but now more people are more comfortable ignoring their abilities so it is fine? Honestly, your logic (if it gets taken and applied to all new content) brings into questions why we even have rules. If we don't need strong rules and well-balanced classes to have fun, then why do we bother having them? Because it provides a good support structure. Just because some people are having fun without those supports does not mean we shouldn't work to make sure those supports are included. Let us not overstate things here. Millions of new people did not add "millions of new approaches to playing the game". We've had millions of players before over the lifetime of Dungeons and Dragons, and we still have only a handful of game playing approaches. I think the biggest number I've ever seen is like "13 player types" or something like that. People have not revolutionized roleplaying games that much, that isn't how entertainment works. [/QUOTE]
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