Ritual spell casting (kinda long)

Phelk

First Post
As you can probably guess by the title of this thread, this is my attempt to create a sort of cooperative spell casting method. Please let me know what ya think, eh?

Definitions:
Ritual: a cooperative attempt by 2 or more arcane spellcasters to combine their power and accomplish something neither of them could accomplish alone.

Mana level: During a ritual, arcane energy gets built up. The amount of energy currently held by the ritual is refered to as the 'mana level'. The mana level of a ritual cannot exceed the total arcane caster levels of it's participants. If the mana level is at it's maximum or the maximum mana level is reduced, the excess arcane energy is lost, dissipating harmlessly into the surrounding enviroment.

Ritual Process
Begining
Before the ritual begins, each of it's participants must position themselves around a central point and be free to move. All participants must be within 15 ft of the central point and must not move further than 15 ft from the central point. If a participant becomes no long able to function, the remaining participants may continue the ritual, but the maximum mana level is reduced appropriately. Note that once the ritual has begun, no new participants may join.

The Ritual
During a ritual, a participant's total focus and concentration is required. If an individual stops participating in the ritual, they may not rejoin it.
A ritual lasts for at least 1 hour. Each hour, each participant must make a Caster Level check equal to 10 + the number of previous hours. If all participants succeed, the ritual's mana level increases by 1. Failure may have a variety of effects depending upon how badly the participant failed their check.
Perhaps the most spectacular of these mishaps is when the mana pool collapses. A mana pool collapse cause the arcane energy to detonate like a bomb dealing 1d6 damage per mana level to everything within a 20 ft radius of the ritual's central point as well as draining all the energy thus far collected, resetting the mana level to 0. Non-participants can make a reflex saving throw (DC = 10 + the mana level) for half damage.
After caster level check, the participants may continue the ritual or choose to end it.

Caster Level Check Failure
Failure by... Effect
1-4... No mana level gained
5-10... No mana level gained and take 1d6 damage
11-15... No mana level gained and mana pool collapses
16+... No mana level gained, mana pool collapses AND all participants gain 1 negative level per mana level

Ending the Ritual
At any time during the ritual, the participants may focus together and expend the accumulated arcane energy to cast a spell. This is a full round action that provokes an attack of opportunity.
The ritual can cast any spell that is on any of the participant's spell list, assuming it's mana level is high enough (see below).
Once the ritual's energy has been used to cast a spell, any excess energy dissipates and all of it's participants become fatigued. Note that if the spell has an XP cost, the cost must be paid by all participants. In addition, if the spell has a costly material component, it must be provided (but only once per casting).

Mana Level Requirement
Spell Level....Mana Level
1...................1
2...................4
3...................6
4...................8
5...................10
6...................12
7...................14
8...................16
9...................18

So... Comments? Gripes? Glaring loop-holes?

Edit 1: Clairified 'caster level checks result'. Thanks, Cheiromancer.
Edit 2: Clairified that a mana pool collaspe resets the mana level to 0.
 
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Any wizard will be able to participate for level+2 hours without risking a mana pool collapse. Even if they roll a 1 in that last check, they just take 1d6 damage.

A dozen or so low level wizards (average level about 2) could routinely cast 9th level spells. Four first level casters contribute for one hour, but drop out if they receive damage. The rest stay around for two. That's 12 mana the first hour, and 8 more the second.

BTW, can they cast *any* high level spell they want, and that they have the components for? How would a bunch of low level wizards know the formulae for a dominate monster spell?

[edit]When you say "spell-list" do you mean class spell list, or one that is known by one of the casters? If the former, then that last question holds; if the latter, I fail to see the point of the ritual- why not have the wizard just cast it himself?

And another thing- who makes decisions required by the spell? And how is spell level, save DC and such determined?[/edit]
 
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This sounds more like something we've got called a spellweb than a ritual. With a spellweb, a bunch of casters pool their energy together, enabling them to cast spells at a higher caster level (but not cast spells they normally couldn't). Course, if the web collapses (through someone dying, failing a Concentration check, etc.), bad things could result from the backlash of power.
 

Gah! Good catch, Cheiromancer. I worded it just ambigiously enough to let that through! It should say that "If all participants succeed their caster level check, then the ritual's mana level increses by 1". If those low level mages wanna cast a wish, their gonna have to keep the ritual going for 18 hours (probably more) and pass caster level checks from hell (the last one would be DC 28 or higher). ;)
I had it as you assumed originally, but, like you, quickly realized how abusable it'd be.
The 'spell list' refered to is the class spell list, just like for being able to use a wand.
Finally, as to who'd make the decisions required for the spell, I guess I'm going to have to add a leader to the ritual, eh? I considered doing this originally, and requireing the leader to have a feat (Arcane Ritual or somesuch). As for caster level, DC and what not, I'm thinking that caster level will be equal to the mana level and to calculate DCs and what have you normally, but as if the caster has no ability modifier.

I've also considered a few other tweaks:
...An XP or $ requirement per hour
...Increasing the caster level DCs (perhaps DC 15+ previous hours?)
...A feat required by at least one member of the ritual
...Rules for concentration checks (being attacked, taking dmg, ect)
...Change caster level check failure? Perhaps eliminate the 'take 1d6 damage' and move everything else up?

Kerrick: That sounds kinda like circle casting used by the Red Wizards, except that it effects everyone involved. Interesting sure, but not exactly what I'm going for. I actually wanted this ritual to allow a group of low level casters cast higher level magics, just with some dangerous side effects.
 
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So if one person fails the ritual check, no extra mana?

What is the benefit of having more than two people performing the ritual? Any more is just more chances for things to go wrong.

In fact... Let's suppose that two 8th level wizards want to ritually cast a 5th level spell. It's only one level above their capacities, so it should be fairly easy. But the ritual will take a minimum of 10 hours, and that only if both of them make their caster checks.

Here's a trial run with dice (d20+8 for each wizard)

Hour 1: 24 and 21 vs DC 10. 1 mp
Hour 2: 26 and 14 vs DC 11. 2 mp
Hour 3: 23 and 17 vs DC 12. 3 mp
Hour 4: 20 and 21 vs DC 13. 4 mp
Hour 5: 23 and 26 vs DC 14. 5 mp
Hour 6: 11 and 18 vs DC 15. 5 mp and 1d6 damage
Hour 7: 13 and 22 vs DC 16. 5 mp and 1d6 damage
Hour 8: 24 and 26 vs DC 17. 6 mp
Hour 9: 16 and 26 vs DC 18. 6 mp and 1d6 damage
Hour 10: 28 and 27 vs DC 19. 7 mp
Hour 11: 10 and 10 vs DC 20. 7 mp, each take 1d6 damage
Hour 12: 14 and 17 vs DC 21. 7 mp, each take 1d6 damage
Hour 13: 20 and 23 vs DC 22. 7 mp and 1d6 damage
Hour 14: 16 and 25 vs DC 23. 7 mp and 1d6 damage
Hour 15: 17 and 28 vs DC 24. 7 mp and 1d6 damage
Hour 16: 20 and 16 vs DC 25. 7 mp, each take 1d6 damage
Hour 17: 11 and 26 vs DC 26. Spell pool collapses.

Hmmm. They didn't come very close, did they? My second trial leaves them with only 6 mp before the pool collapses. My third, only 4 mp.

What do your trials come up with?
 

:o Actually, I hadn't done trials yet, I was busily still ironing out the text...
BTW, the benefit of more than two participants would be a higher maximum mana level, as well as having a few buddies to 'feel your pain'... ;)
And thanks for the trial info, I think it proves what I was afraid of: the DCs may be too high.
I'm thinking I either need to lower the DCs, or perhaps add some sort of additional benefit for having multiple participants, such as a +1 bonus on the caster level checks for each participants beyond the first... Still, even if I grant that +1 bonus, that's only going to give our intrepid mages a +1 bonus... Chances are, they're still going to fail and get blown up.
I don't want to make these rituals too easy, of course. They do allow a spellcaster to cast a spell without knowning it, or indeed without even having access to it. Then again, I want it to be something that a spellcaster wouldn't have to be insane to even consider.
Perhaps I'll play around with the DC a bit lower (say 6-9ish).
Again, thanks for the trials, Cheiromancer, you've been increadibly helpful!
 

Actually, looking over the data again... Perhaps the problem isn't the DCs, but the penalty for failure. The two mages Cheiromancer mentioned actually had a fairly decent chance of getting the mana level high enough, but the high chance of the mana pool collasping pretty much garentees that they won't get a second chance.
I'm thinking I'll modify the caster level checks failure table to look like this:

Failure by... Effect
1-14... No mana level gained
15-20... No mana level gained and mana pool collapses
21+... No mana level gained, pool collapses, and participants gain 1 negative level per mana level

I think I'll also add that +1 to all caster level checks per extra participants beyond first. Hmm... perhaps a +1 for every 5 non-participants that stand around chanting or something, too.

Thoughts?
 

It's an awful lot of dice rolling, too.

What if you had just one person make the casting level check, and each other participant in the ritual gave a +1 to that check? If a check is failed, everyone takes 1d6 damage per failure, and no mana is gained that hour. That's 1d6 for the first failure, 2d6 for the second, and so on.

The maximum mana level would be the level of the principal caster, plus one third of the total levels of the participants.

The number of people involved in the ritual cannot exceed the caster level of the principal.

So in the example with two 8 level wizards, one would be the principal, the other the assistant. 8 divided by 3 is two, so they can just barely get enough mana for a 5th level spell. (But two people is an awfully small ritual!). In 11 or 12 hours they should have enough mana- at the cost of a few dice of damage.

Eight wizards, all of 8th level, would have a maximum mana pool of 26, and the principal caster would have a bonus of +15 to his d20 roll. So they are safe for the first seven hours of the ritual, but after that they risk taking damage.

Let's see (d20 + 15 vs escalating DC's):

Hour 8: 31 vs DC 17 8 mp
Hour 9: 28 vs DC 18 9 mp
Hour 10: 26 vs DC 19 10 mp
Hour 11: 18 vs DC 20, 10 mp and 1d6 damage
Hour 12: 27 vs DC 21, 11 mp
Hour 13: 33 vs DC 22, 12 mp
Hour 14: 30 vs DC 23, 13 mp
Hour 15: 21 vs DC 24, 13 mp and 2d6 damage
Hour 16: 30 vs DC 25, 14 mp
Hour 17: 34 vs DC 26, 15 mp
Hour 18: 17 vs DC 27, 15 mp and 3d6 damage
Hour 19: 27 vs DC 28, 15 mp and 4d6 damage
Hour 20: 16 vs DC 29, mana pool collapses

Hmmm. Looks like 9th level spells might be a little out of the reach of a cabal led by an 8th level wizard. There's enough mana for a 7th level spell, though, at around 16 hours.

And a 9th level wizard with 8 assistants would have check results +2 greater than listed above, and would be able to get 8th level spells (no failure at hour 11, so hour 17 would have netted 16 mana points). Kinda dodgy thereafter.

Looks like a cabal of maximum size (n wizards of level n each) can manage to pull off a spell of level n-1, and probably about 3d6 damage to all participants. Sound reasonable?
 

Kerrick: That sounds kinda like circle casting used by the Red Wizards, except that it effects everyone involved. Interesting sure, but not exactly what I'm going for. I actually wanted this ritual to allow a group of low level casters cast higher level magics, just with some dangerous side effects.

I'm not really familiar with circle casting, so I can't say anything on that point.

...A feat required by at least one member of the ritual
...Rules for concentration checks (being attacked, taking dmg, ect)

We require feats for both Ritual Casting and forming a spell web, as well as for being a focus (leader) for both. We might ditch the Ritual Casting feat and keep the Ritual Focus, though (yes, our rituals have to have a leader to focus the energy), as most spellcasters (we allow anyone, arcane or divine, to join with like spellcasters to cast ritual magic) gain at least rudimentary training in ritual magic.

Looks like a cabal of maximum size (n wizards of level n each) can manage to pull off a spell of level n-1, and probably about 3d6 damage to all participants. Sound reasonable?

Not bad. Even considering the fact that a bunch of 10th level casters can throw off a 9th level spell, it'll still take them several hours to do it, and cost them some damage. (BTW, don't they have to make Concentration checks when taking this damage?)
One thing I'm kind of wondering - how can they cast spells above their level if they don't know them? I mean, I could see them being able to cast the spell if the leader has it scribed into his book (you can do that, even if it's a higher level than you can cast), but if it's some spell they've never even seen (even if it is a common spell like, say, meteor swarm), how can they do it?
 

Wow, guys, thanks a lot. I bet I would have never thought of half this stuff by myself.
Kerrick - that part about letting any spellcaster help is a good idea. The most common type of magic IS probably going to be shamanistic, right? Besides, getting the divine agent of a god (cleric) to lend his approval/aid should count for something, yeah?
And your question about how would a caster know about a spell they don't know/have in their spellbook is a good one too. Honestly, I dunno. I suppose one could say that it's somewhat like the sort of research a wizard does during their adventuring to discover new formula (the 2 free spell/level). A ritual like this would be the same thing, just quicker, dirtier, and quite a bit more dangerous. I could have went with the "one participant must provide the spell in question" road, but I kinda wanted this sort of thing to be handy for the sorcerer, too. They seem to get the short end of the stick quite a bit.
Cheiromancer - having one participant (the leader) make the checks fixes several problems, I see. Now, having a lower level helper in the ritual isn't such a nasty burden/death sentence, plus, as you said, it cuts down substantially on the dice rolling. And that method for calculating the check bonus is darn good.
 

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