Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
White Dwarf Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Nest
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
EN Publishing
Twitter
BlueSky
Facebook
Instagram
EN World
BlueSky
YouTube
Facebook
Twitter
Twitch
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
Robert J. Schwalb Blog Discussion; Feats: Do We need them?
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="tuxgeo" data-source="post: 5519854" data-attributes="member: 61026"><p><strong>Some thoughts on Feats:</strong></p><p></p><p>1. Feats give access to options that don't fit neatly onto a planned schedule. PCs can take feats in their own preferred sequence, instead of taking them at the time that a class schedule specifies. This is one of the primary benefits of having feats, and informs much else. </p><p></p><p>2. Character-defining at first level: </p><p>• If I want my Tiefling Paladin to have the dark stain of a Warlock Pact that was sealed before the Paladin's holy vows were taken, a first-level feat can provide that. This characteristic really shouldn't be an optional feature of the Paladin class, because then you'd need a separate Paladin option for each possible multiclass that a Paladin could start with. Multiclass feats do something that class features shouldn't. </p><p>• If I want my Elf Bard to start adventuring at age 70 with a backstory including many decades of life experience before gaining arcane powers, a first-level feat "Bard Of All Trades" can reflect that. Few bards will have such extensive life experience, so this characteristic fits best as a first-level feat, not an optional class feature. (And probably not a racial feature, either.) </p><p>(In order to create the "backstory" effect that I'm looking for here, these feats must be available at 1st level.) </p><p></p><p>3. Skill powers (another of Schwalb's earlier projects): </p><p>These are alternative powers that anyone can take, requiring only high enough level and training in a specific skill. </p><p>The whole point is to provide alternatives to (overly) restrictive class power silos, so these should not be replaced by class features. </p><p>The "Skill Power" feat is one way to obtain these powers, and should be retained. This is an excellent use of a feat. (Great stuff, rjs.) </p><p></p><p>4. Racials: <strong>Classes</strong> give out powers and features in 4E, but <strong>Races</strong> don't; so the path for enhancing racial traits is provided by Feats. </p><p>Now imagine, for a brief while, that 5E is going to have a scheduled litany of Racial powers and features that PCs must choose among, paralleling the Class powers and features. How many such powers and features would there have to be? It would require huge amounts of space and imagination to come up with enough stuff to fill 30 levels for each of however many races there are now! The resulting page-bloat would be a killer. </p><p>Feats are a much better mechanic for inserting racial enhancements, because keeping those enhancements in the list of feats means that you don't have to come up with hundreds of pages of them, and you don't have to assign a specific level at which each one becomes available to the race getting the enhancement. (Why should an Elf only get "Light Step" at Level 4, or whenever -- why not at the time of the player's choosing?) </p><p></p><p>5. "Enhance this class power" feats -- </p><p>Both the Arena Fighting Style feats and the Divine Domain Power feats offer specific advantages to the user of some specific 1st-level At-Will attack powers. That is drastically limiting, because it doesn't provide for retraining of At-Wills, and it doesn't provide for newer At-Will powers that become available later. The planned obsolescence in this category of feats is deplorable, and all of these feats should die a quick and horrible, editorial death (<em>next <s>session</s> edition</em>).</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="tuxgeo, post: 5519854, member: 61026"] [b]Some thoughts on Feats:[/b] 1. Feats give access to options that don't fit neatly onto a planned schedule. PCs can take feats in their own preferred sequence, instead of taking them at the time that a class schedule specifies. This is one of the primary benefits of having feats, and informs much else. 2. Character-defining at first level: • If I want my Tiefling Paladin to have the dark stain of a Warlock Pact that was sealed before the Paladin's holy vows were taken, a first-level feat can provide that. This characteristic really shouldn't be an optional feature of the Paladin class, because then you'd need a separate Paladin option for each possible multiclass that a Paladin could start with. Multiclass feats do something that class features shouldn't. • If I want my Elf Bard to start adventuring at age 70 with a backstory including many decades of life experience before gaining arcane powers, a first-level feat "Bard Of All Trades" can reflect that. Few bards will have such extensive life experience, so this characteristic fits best as a first-level feat, not an optional class feature. (And probably not a racial feature, either.) (In order to create the "backstory" effect that I'm looking for here, these feats must be available at 1st level.) 3. Skill powers (another of Schwalb's earlier projects): These are alternative powers that anyone can take, requiring only high enough level and training in a specific skill. The whole point is to provide alternatives to (overly) restrictive class power silos, so these should not be replaced by class features. The "Skill Power" feat is one way to obtain these powers, and should be retained. This is an excellent use of a feat. (Great stuff, rjs.) 4. Racials: [B]Classes[/B] give out powers and features in 4E, but [B]Races[/B] don't; so the path for enhancing racial traits is provided by Feats. Now imagine, for a brief while, that 5E is going to have a scheduled litany of Racial powers and features that PCs must choose among, paralleling the Class powers and features. How many such powers and features would there have to be? It would require huge amounts of space and imagination to come up with enough stuff to fill 30 levels for each of however many races there are now! The resulting page-bloat would be a killer. Feats are a much better mechanic for inserting racial enhancements, because keeping those enhancements in the list of feats means that you don't have to come up with hundreds of pages of them, and you don't have to assign a specific level at which each one becomes available to the race getting the enhancement. (Why should an Elf only get "Light Step" at Level 4, or whenever -- why not at the time of the player's choosing?) 5. "Enhance this class power" feats -- Both the Arena Fighting Style feats and the Divine Domain Power feats offer specific advantages to the user of some specific 1st-level At-Will attack powers. That is drastically limiting, because it doesn't provide for retraining of At-Wills, and it doesn't provide for newer At-Will powers that become available later. The planned obsolescence in this category of feats is deplorable, and all of these feats should die a quick and horrible, editorial death ([I]next [s]session[/s] edition[/I]). [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
Robert J. Schwalb Blog Discussion; Feats: Do We need them?
Top