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Message: <blockquote data-quote="DogBackward" data-source="post: 6047030" data-attributes="member: 50642">The problem is that you're saying two things. One: "You shouldn't be able to improvise without spending special points on it." Two: "Only the Rogue should be good at improvisation."First of all, everybody should be able to try these improvised tactics, and should be able to try them without having to spend some sort of metagame resource. Why should I have to spend a point of something to do something that anyone can try? And why the hell should only the Rogue be able to master the swinging chandelier?Second, the level of meta-manipulation is simply too high for some people's games. Basing an entire class's schtick around something that doesn't fit in many play styles is just bad design.Finally, there is nothing wrong with the Rogue using Expertise. People keep whining because the Rogue isn't as good a Fighter as the Fighter... that's the point. The Fighter is best at dealing damage, the Rogue is best at skills. You get twice as many skills, and Skill Mastery is an amazing maneuver. And, oh, side-note: it makes the Rogue best at improvisation, by giving him the highest skill checks available to a player.People need to quit thinking of the Rogue in 3e/4e "I'm a spike-damage dealer" terms, and remember that the Rogue started out as just the clever thief. Even thinking back to classic media, the Rogue-type character never manages to fight as well as the main warrior, not even with finesse and panache. In an entire fight scene, you might see the plucky thief wait and watch, and finally jump in for that last-minute backstab... getting one kill to the seven the brave hero already has.And for the record: that flashy, finesse-based duelist (the one that's always riding the chandeliers from here to there) is not a Rogue, he's a Fighter.Modern MMO's and recent editions of D&D have fixated players on this idea that the Rogue is some sort of DPS/Striker, when that's only a recent development. You will never play a Rogue that matches a Fighter in combat. That's the entire point of having different classes.</blockquote>

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