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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Vegepygmy" data-source="post: 5267227" data-attributes="member: 40109">Your first instincts were correct. Spare us the ad hominem, please, and support your arguments with something worthwhile instead. Fair enough. I have nothing against brainstorming. Then you should have no trouble citing some text that supports such an obvious conclusion. Go ahead. I'll wait. As for your appeal to numbers, I have no idea what the literally hundreds of people I've played with for over 30 years thought about auras being or not being part of oneself, and I don't believe you ever discussed it with your associates, either. And if you did, I'll bet 99% of them couldn't have cared less, and would have happily agreed with whatever you said just to get you to stop asking them about it. You are making assumptions about glitterdust and faerie fire that are not supported (or contradicted, as far as I know) by the actual rules. But as I said, okay, whatever. This is not an argument that can be won either way, so I'm not arguing against your interpretation. I'm just pointing out that you are (as in the case of auras obviously being part of oneself) assuming facts not in evidence. What I said is what I really meant, but you didn't understand it. I asked you to remind me why it wouldn't suck (because I've apparently forgotten). You agree that it wouldn't suck, so please tell me why. I think it would suck (for the paladin, at least) if a supernatural ability granted by divine powers could be neutralized by ordinary household furnishings. But here, I'll make your argument for you. You don't think that magic should necessarily be more potent than extraordinary skill in a fantasy world. Which is a fair enough thing to say. But is there any reason why extraordinary skill should be more potent than magic? Just something to ruminate on. It's only "so easily" for the tiny fraction of a percent of people in our fantasy world who have been chosen by a god to sniff out evil or have studied arcane secrets for the many years required to bend space and time to their will (and by the way, if we place such importance on the years of training our hypothetical rogue has spent honing his skills, why are we so quick to dismiss the wizard's training and/or the paladin's divine favor?). And even then, as has been fully explained previously in this thread, it's not very easy at all. In fact, it's so not-easy that it's hardly ever worth bothering to try. If I've treated you or your arguments unfairly, I apologize. But I don't think I have. I don't agree with you. I'm sure the people who play with me are okay with that, or they would have stopped asking me to play and DM games. Oh, please. Detect magic and detect evil are so potent that rogue types don't have a "chance" against them? Gimme a break! We agree on that much, at least.</blockquote>

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