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Rogue with telling blow
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<blockquote data-quote="Kmart Kommando" data-source="post: 3215567" data-attributes="member: 39915"><p>Razing Strike says "the bonus on damage rolls is 1d6 per level of the spell sacrificed, plus any extra damage based on your sneak attack ability"</p><p></p><p>And a lance-weilding Leap Attacking Barbarian at level 7 will be doing + Power Attack damage x4, without critting. Add in a crit, or a crit with a greataxe, then compare it to the damage a rogue will be doing. Crits are supposed to hurt, but a rogue's double SA crit pales in comparison to the barbarian's PA crit.</p><p></p><p>Let's give both characters an 18 STR, unlikely for a rogue, but still.</p><p></p><p>Barbarian: damage on a greataxe crit = power attack for 6 (2 from charge, 2 from rage, 2 to match rogue's BAB), 1.5 x str x 3, 3d12 average 19.5. 36 + 18 + 19.5 = 73.5 and that's even without Leap Attack. (with Leap Attack, we're looking at around 80 damage)</p><p></p><p>Rogue: effectively doubled SA damage with Rapier crit (best weapon on rogue list) = str x 2, 10d6 (2d6 rapier crit + 8d6 effective SA) average 30.5. 8 + 30.5 = 38.5 </p><p></p><p>73.5 > 38.5 by far</p><p></p><p>Barbarian single-handing a longsword instead, Leap attack 18 + 6 + 2d8 average 9 = 33</p><p>This is less than optimal, so we'll look at rogue without flanking.</p><p></p><p>Rogue: 8 + 6d6 average 21 = 29</p><p></p><p>33 > 29 and the rogue's total attack bonus is several points less.</p><p></p><p>Oh, and Telling Blow only says add you sneak attack damage to your crit, nothing about 'you can't do this and sneak attack your target too'. This feat came out after the sneak attack ability did, and most other feats that came out later have the limits and qualifiers written into them. Or at least say "this feat lets you sneak attack anything you crit." Which is exactly what you're saying this feat does. So saying 'they meant this even though it says this' doesn't change anything until the errata comes out and says so. This feat looks like it's making the rogue act like a burst weapon between flanking and not flanking. I'm not saying that's right, but there's another precedent to look at, game mechanics-wise .</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Kmart Kommando, post: 3215567, member: 39915"] Razing Strike says "the bonus on damage rolls is 1d6 per level of the spell sacrificed, plus any extra damage based on your sneak attack ability" And a lance-weilding Leap Attacking Barbarian at level 7 will be doing + Power Attack damage x4, without critting. Add in a crit, or a crit with a greataxe, then compare it to the damage a rogue will be doing. Crits are supposed to hurt, but a rogue's double SA crit pales in comparison to the barbarian's PA crit. Let's give both characters an 18 STR, unlikely for a rogue, but still. Barbarian: damage on a greataxe crit = power attack for 6 (2 from charge, 2 from rage, 2 to match rogue's BAB), 1.5 x str x 3, 3d12 average 19.5. 36 + 18 + 19.5 = 73.5 and that's even without Leap Attack. (with Leap Attack, we're looking at around 80 damage) Rogue: effectively doubled SA damage with Rapier crit (best weapon on rogue list) = str x 2, 10d6 (2d6 rapier crit + 8d6 effective SA) average 30.5. 8 + 30.5 = 38.5 73.5 > 38.5 by far Barbarian single-handing a longsword instead, Leap attack 18 + 6 + 2d8 average 9 = 33 This is less than optimal, so we'll look at rogue without flanking. Rogue: 8 + 6d6 average 21 = 29 33 > 29 and the rogue's total attack bonus is several points less. Oh, and Telling Blow only says add you sneak attack damage to your crit, nothing about 'you can't do this and sneak attack your target too'. This feat came out after the sneak attack ability did, and most other feats that came out later have the limits and qualifiers written into them. Or at least say "this feat lets you sneak attack anything you crit." Which is exactly what you're saying this feat does. So saying 'they meant this even though it says this' doesn't change anything until the errata comes out and says so. This feat looks like it's making the rogue act like a burst weapon between flanking and not flanking. I'm not saying that's right, but there's another precedent to look at, game mechanics-wise . [/QUOTE]
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