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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Saeviomagy" data-source="post: 6880316" data-attributes="member: 5890">The original point was about stealth being something a character can be good at, and D&D tending to take the approach that if you don't have magic, you can't do anything that approaches real-world levels of performance, let alone heroic things.I think that's kind of what's happening here: people are assessing that a rogue cannot hide in a room when the lights are on, even from unaware foes, which of course leads to the idea that any rogue that needs light to operate is worthless.The reality should be that the bulk of monsters also need light to operate properly, and that in most places that are being used there will be plenty of darkened areas to hide in.</blockquote>