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Message: <blockquote data-quote="HammerMan" data-source="post: 8485064" data-attributes="member: 84112">So in the case of a NPC King persuading a Bard, the Players's job is to, as fairly as possible, assess the likelihood of success.  And that involves knowing their PCs, what their motivations and personality and foibles are like, to determine that possibility.  In other words, the Player is roleplaying the PC.  It is roleplaying when they say, "No, sorry, there's no way you're going to persuade him of that."  It is roleplaying when they say, "Yes!  The Bard jumps to his feet and agrees!"  And it is still roleplaying when they say, "Hmm...that's tricky. Let me see a Charisma roll; you can use either Deception or Persuasion, depending on how you want to play it. 18 or higher and he'll agree."just like the PCexcept you get the "I want to marry the kings daughter."  "OKay, he doesn't seem likely to agree what do you do?"  "I persuade him by telling him how strong my blood line is what a great hero I am and tell him the tales of the last few games." "Okay, so roll CHa+persasion at DC 18,"Bard player rolls a 27 (18+9)so the DM says "Okay, you have convinced him of what a hero you are and how your blood line would help his, but since he still doesn't want the princesses to marry you, he offers you his niece."</blockquote>