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<blockquote data-quote="jolt" data-source="post: 3787990" data-attributes="member: 18142">Except that's not what's happening nor is it what they said.&nbsp; What really happens is: you choose your role and then, if you don't take one of two classes, you are teh-gimp-suxxor.&nbsp; And if what you said is true, then it certainly doesn;t fit into their &quot;Any class, Any combo&quot; theory. Which I'm not.&nbsp; Nor is it inherently good to do so.&nbsp; That's the point I'm trying (and apparently failing) to make.It's the other way around actually.&nbsp; Your first definition is what leader means in a general sense.&nbsp; Your second definition of leader never existed before mmorpg's.&nbsp; Heck, even the word &quot;buff&quot; doesn't mean what we use it for in computer gaming and now, unfortunately, in pen &amp; paper rpg's too.&nbsp; Mmorpg's are a completely different medium than pen &amp; paper rpg's.&nbsp; Mmmorpg concepts should stay in mmorpg's.&nbsp; I find it disheartening that the designers looked at World of Warcraft(TM), saw a huge fan base and thought &quot;Wow, that must be kewl.&nbsp; Let's put those things in our game so it can be kewl too.&quot;&nbsp; The idea of Roles was lifted straight from mmorpg's.&nbsp; Their own definition of the roles and the terminologies they use are straight from WoW, CoH and other such games.Maybe when the books come out I'll look at them and say, &quot;Wow! This is the best thing since sliced AND unsliced bread!&quot;&nbsp; But that isn't what I'm seeing now.&nbsp; What I see now is a fantasy version of CoH trying to be shoehorned into a pen &amp; paper format and called D&amp;D.&nbsp; I see a lot of restrictions in a game that was supposed to be about options.&nbsp; I see supposedly kewl concepts being blatantly ripped off from mmorpg's and crammed into a game that exists in an entirely different medium with a different fan base.&nbsp; Sure, some people play both, I do.&nbsp; But I play them for what makes them unique and interesting, not for their similarities.&nbsp; They said they weren't trying to make D&amp;D into a videogame but that's exactly what I see them doing (as much as is possible in a non-computer setting anyway).&nbsp; I see metagame ideas being turned into mechanical concepts.&nbsp; I see the mage being turned into the &quot;I am a kewl Blaster!&quot; and the Cleric being turned into &quot;I am the l33t healr!&quot;&nbsp; Maybe some people like that, but I don't.jolt</blockquote>

[QUOTE="jolt, post: 3787990, member: 18142"] Except that's not what's happening nor is it what they said. What really happens is: you choose your role and then, if you don't take one of two classes, you are teh-gimp-suxxor. And if what you said is true, then it certainly doesn;t fit into their "Any class, Any combo" theory. Which I'm not. Nor is it inherently good to do so. That's the point I'm trying (and apparently failing) to make. It's the other way around actually. Your first definition is what leader means in a general sense. Your second definition of leader never existed before mmorpg's. Heck, even the word "buff" doesn't mean what we use it for in computer gaming and now, unfortunately, in pen & paper rpg's too. Mmorpg's are a completely different medium than pen & paper rpg's. Mmmorpg concepts should stay in mmorpg's. I find it disheartening that the designers looked at World of Warcraft(TM), saw a huge fan base and thought "Wow, that must be kewl. Let's put those things in our game so it can be kewl too." The idea of Roles was lifted straight from mmorpg's. Their own definition of the roles and the terminologies they use are straight from WoW, CoH and other such games. Maybe when the books come out I'll look at them and say, "Wow! This is the best thing since sliced AND unsliced bread!" But that isn't what I'm seeing now. What I see now is a fantasy version of CoH trying to be shoehorned into a pen & paper format and called D&D. I see a lot of restrictions in a game that was supposed to be about options. I see supposedly kewl concepts being blatantly ripped off from mmorpg's and crammed into a game that exists in an entirely different medium with a different fan base. Sure, some people play both, I do. But I play them for what makes them unique and interesting, not for their similarities. They said they weren't trying to make D&D into a videogame but that's exactly what I see them doing (as much as is possible in a non-computer setting anyway). I see metagame ideas being turned into mechanical concepts. I see the mage being turned into the "I am a kewl Blaster!" and the Cleric being turned into "I am the l33t healr!" Maybe some people like that, but I don't. jolt [/QUOTE]

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