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<blockquote data-quote="Crimson Longinus" data-source="post: 8442420" data-attributes="member: 7025508"><p>Action declaration is to search for traps. Presumably in reality this process has several steps, starting with looking for anything obviously sus. Of course the character will not touch it if they notice the poison/death runes/whatever at this point. </p><p></p><p></p><p>It doesn't say that. Nevertheless, sounds reasonable.</p><p></p><p></p><p>Right. And I argue 'I search the chest for traps' is sufficient to allow the investigation roll with the stated difficulty. And I think it is pretty clear that the bureau example backs this up. The idea that the trap would need more detail than that simply is not supported by anything.</p><p></p><p></p><p>So 'lock is ornate' is the telegraph, and they need to specifically look in the lock, not just examine the chest? I don't think this is in line of the bureau example, but I guess it makes sense. Then again, why not require that they say the specifically look for an needle in order to get to roll? Certainly you must admit that where one draws the line is rather arbitrary?</p><p></p><p>BTW. This is actually a pretty sensible trap. This is the sort of trap most players might indeed know to suspect, as it could exist in reality and is pretty well known type of trap. But a lot of traps are not like that.</p><p> </p><p></p><p>Ultimately in a game where the player doesn't know whether they succeed or fail when making the action declaration it limits their ability to describe somewhat. But II really don't think this needs to lead to lacklustre action declarations. </p><p></p><p>But you know what. I'm going to agree with you halfway. I think relatively broad action declarations should generally suffice to get to roll. But if the player describes something more specific that happens to be particularly effective for the situation, they should get lower DC or an advantage.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Crimson Longinus, post: 8442420, member: 7025508"] Action declaration is to search for traps. Presumably in reality this process has several steps, starting with looking for anything obviously sus. Of course the character will not touch it if they notice the poison/death runes/whatever at this point. It doesn't say that. Nevertheless, sounds reasonable. Right. And I argue 'I search the chest for traps' is sufficient to allow the investigation roll with the stated difficulty. And I think it is pretty clear that the bureau example backs this up. The idea that the trap would need more detail than that simply is not supported by anything. So 'lock is ornate' is the telegraph, and they need to specifically look in the lock, not just examine the chest? I don't think this is in line of the bureau example, but I guess it makes sense. Then again, why not require that they say the specifically look for an needle in order to get to roll? Certainly you must admit that where one draws the line is rather arbitrary? BTW. This is actually a pretty sensible trap. This is the sort of trap most players might indeed know to suspect, as it could exist in reality and is pretty well known type of trap. But a lot of traps are not like that. Ultimately in a game where the player doesn't know whether they succeed or fail when making the action declaration it limits their ability to describe somewhat. But II really don't think this needs to lead to lacklustre action declarations. But you know what. I'm going to agree with you halfway. I think relatively broad action declarations should generally suffice to get to roll. But if the player describes something more specific that happens to be particularly effective for the situation, they should get lower DC or an advantage. [/QUOTE]
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