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Roshambo-Style Theatre of the Mind Combat
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<blockquote data-quote="volanin" data-source="post: 7276069" data-attributes="member: 69817"><p>This sounds like a very good solution, which I immediately took to playtesting! But in 5e, the concept of round for powers in general is not meant to be "until the last count of initiative", but instead it's meant as "until the creature's next turn". And when you have a lot of creatures in combat, this becomes a nuisance to track... so I took your solution, but limited to the current turn instead:</p><p></p><p>- If a creature Disengages, all the creatures it were Engaged with cannot Intercept it until the end of its turn.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Yes, this is by design.</p><p>As a DM, you can always limit the number of simultaneous engagements, but in practice this rarely comes into play.</p><p></p><p>As an aside... even when using a grid, there is nothing preventing 10 orcs from engaging the wizard, except for the physical space itself, which is already pretty generous (up to 8 squares surrounding the wizard, up to 24 squares if the enemies are using reach weapons). And much before that, by the time you have 2-3 orcs engaged with a wizard, things are already going downhill...</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I actually had to reread this a few times to understand what you wanted to do.</p><p>No, it's not possible for a Fighter to be Intercepted by 10 enemies simultaneously in a single turn.</p><p></p><p>When a Fighter attempts to Engage a creature, he can be Intercepted by another enemy. Even if there are 10 enemies willing to Intercept him, as soon as the first Interception happens, he is already Engaged with this enemy, and his original engagement failed. The other 9 enemies cannot keep on Intercepting, as there is nothing to Intercept any longer...</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Let me try to clarify this, as it comes up often.</p><p>There are actually two separate systems in the same PDF:</p><p></p><p><strong>1. </strong>The Engagement Rules + Freedom of Movement + Range and Area Conversions, this is the "core system".</p><p><strong>2. </strong>The Roshambo-Style Tactical Movement, this is the "expansion to the core system".</p><p></p><p>The first part ("core system") is intended to make TotM easy to track and adjudicate. If you want to play TotM with minimum modifications to the current rules, you can completely ignore the Roshambo Tactical Movement ("expansion"). You will Engage with creatures in combat as part of your movement (in the same way that happens in Grid combat). And just like Grid play, you will usually stay Engaged with this creature until you kill it and move on to the next one...</p><p></p><p>What I mean is: The main form of engaging creatures is just moving up to them and becoming Engaged (or having they Engage you in their turn). You don't have to spend an Action to do that, and all the perks of the Fighter class work as intended.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>But in TotM play, this quickly degenerates into boring combat, as the tactics are very, very shallow.</p><p>Tactics are basically reduced to "will I spend or save a power, and, will I attack or support"...</p><p>And that's where the second part, the optional part, the "expansion" comes along:</p><p></p><p>It gives every combatant "small tactical powers", that simply add more depth to the tactics in TotM, to make combat more interesting. Now you have more <strong>decision points</strong> in combat: Will I spend my reaction to Intercept, or save it to make an opportunity attack? Will I spend my Action to Dash, or should I trust that the enemy won't Intercept me? Should I burn an Action to lock down an additional enemy now and be able to make an opportunity attack later, or risk being unable to do anything if it goes for a weaker party member when its turn comes up?</p><p></p><p>It's just options.</p><p>Combat already works without them.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Actually, it's easier, you're just overthinking it!</p><p>The table (which actually comes from the Dungeon Master's Guide) already lists what you want:</p><p></p><p>Cylinder, Circle and Sphere areas are actually written as <strong>radius ÷ 5 </strong>(and not size ÷ 5) and need no extra conversion to "five-foot squares". So, in your example, the Fireball with a 20 foot-radius-sphere would convert directly to <strong>radius ÷ 5</strong>, which are 4 targets!</p><p></p><p>Don't complain about the number of targets being only 4!</p><p>These are the official WotC variant rules, not mine!</p><p><img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite8" alt=":D" title="Big grin :D" loading="lazy" data-shortname=":D" /></p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="volanin, post: 7276069, member: 69817"] This sounds like a very good solution, which I immediately took to playtesting! But in 5e, the concept of round for powers in general is not meant to be "until the last count of initiative", but instead it's meant as "until the creature's next turn". And when you have a lot of creatures in combat, this becomes a nuisance to track... so I took your solution, but limited to the current turn instead: - If a creature Disengages, all the creatures it were Engaged with cannot Intercept it until the end of its turn. Yes, this is by design. As a DM, you can always limit the number of simultaneous engagements, but in practice this rarely comes into play. As an aside... even when using a grid, there is nothing preventing 10 orcs from engaging the wizard, except for the physical space itself, which is already pretty generous (up to 8 squares surrounding the wizard, up to 24 squares if the enemies are using reach weapons). And much before that, by the time you have 2-3 orcs engaged with a wizard, things are already going downhill... I actually had to reread this a few times to understand what you wanted to do. No, it's not possible for a Fighter to be Intercepted by 10 enemies simultaneously in a single turn. When a Fighter attempts to Engage a creature, he can be Intercepted by another enemy. Even if there are 10 enemies willing to Intercept him, as soon as the first Interception happens, he is already Engaged with this enemy, and his original engagement failed. The other 9 enemies cannot keep on Intercepting, as there is nothing to Intercept any longer... Let me try to clarify this, as it comes up often. There are actually two separate systems in the same PDF: [B]1. [/B]The Engagement Rules + Freedom of Movement + Range and Area Conversions, this is the "core system". [B]2. [/B]The Roshambo-Style Tactical Movement, this is the "expansion to the core system". The first part ("core system") is intended to make TotM easy to track and adjudicate. If you want to play TotM with minimum modifications to the current rules, you can completely ignore the Roshambo Tactical Movement ("expansion"). You will Engage with creatures in combat as part of your movement (in the same way that happens in Grid combat). And just like Grid play, you will usually stay Engaged with this creature until you kill it and move on to the next one... What I mean is: The main form of engaging creatures is just moving up to them and becoming Engaged (or having they Engage you in their turn). You don't have to spend an Action to do that, and all the perks of the Fighter class work as intended. But in TotM play, this quickly degenerates into boring combat, as the tactics are very, very shallow. Tactics are basically reduced to "will I spend or save a power, and, will I attack or support"... And that's where the second part, the optional part, the "expansion" comes along: It gives every combatant "small tactical powers", that simply add more depth to the tactics in TotM, to make combat more interesting. Now you have more [B]decision points[/B] in combat: Will I spend my reaction to Intercept, or save it to make an opportunity attack? Will I spend my Action to Dash, or should I trust that the enemy won't Intercept me? Should I burn an Action to lock down an additional enemy now and be able to make an opportunity attack later, or risk being unable to do anything if it goes for a weaker party member when its turn comes up? It's just options. Combat already works without them. Actually, it's easier, you're just overthinking it! The table (which actually comes from the Dungeon Master's Guide) already lists what you want: Cylinder, Circle and Sphere areas are actually written as [B]radius ÷ 5 [/B](and not size ÷ 5) and need no extra conversion to "five-foot squares". So, in your example, the Fireball with a 20 foot-radius-sphere would convert directly to [B]radius ÷ 5[/B], which are 4 targets! Don't complain about the number of targets being only 4! These are the official WotC variant rules, not mine! :D [/QUOTE]
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