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RPG Evolution: The Trouble with Halflings
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<blockquote data-quote="Chaosmancer" data-source="post: 8693898" data-attributes="member: 6801228"><p>Ah wonderful, a mind reader. Always fun to discuss things with them. You know what card I picked up to? </p><p></p><p>How about, instead of telling me what my intent is, you listen to what I say my intent it.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Most people haven't even addressed my point, instead explaining the mechanics of the game to me. So yes, people who aren't making arguments in regards to my point aren't getting those arguments seriously addressed. I provided one example, because it was easy to find and post. That doesn't mean it is literally the only example that exists. But I don't feel like trying to track down 50 years of novels and comics to try and lay out every single example.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>WOW, it is almost like I said that exact same thing, and was talking about that exact thing! Now, can we discuss my actual points about how that can be problematic and how that is a burden on the DM that no other race imposes? Or do you want to do another round of telling me how the lucky mechanics work before telling me that they aren't the narrative, and if you want the narrative then you need to add that in extra? I mean, I've only gone around three times, what's a dozen more.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I was showing a narrative example of halfling luck. One that has appeared in multiple media. You are obsessing over the exact example and not seeing it as AN EXAMPLE. </p><p></p><p>Like, honestly, do you think halflings have been depicted as unusually lucky in only a single comic in all of DnD history?</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>And here it is again. If the narrative isn't working, it is the fault of the players and the DM, it can't be that the narrative is flawed. </p><p></p><p>So, my human knight has to be willing to scared of ghosts to show-off how brave the halfling rogue is? Because my roleplaying needs to be dictated by other people's racial choices? As a DM, if the human players aren't acting properly scared, should I tell them that their characters would absolutely be scared by the situation, because they aren't halflings? I believe that you said that was bad to do if I was forcing an elf to aloof, but forcing a human to be scared so the halfling can be brave is fine? </p><p></p><p>Because I don't care about the NPCs, their narrative is completely at my discretion as the DM, but the players are going to be paying attention to the other players. And the halfling can't feel incredibly brave if everyone is incredibly brave. </p><p></p><p>And on the luck, you are literally advocating for the thing I refered to as the problem. Having good fortune befall the halfling while making sure good fortune does not befall the other players. This is a limitation on the DM's narration that only exists when we start talking about halflings. And sure, the halfling finding an extra copper in the road isn't going to ruin the game, but halfling luck is supposed to be consistent, meaning it isn't just going to be one time finding a copper, it is going to be likely something every other gaming session, and eventually, that adds up to special treatment. Which is not something we should be advocating for happening, and can be a problem in the game when it happens.</p><p></p><p>You are literally sitting here, telling me that the solution is to engage in the behavior I'm calling out as a problem.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>And when you are dealing with narrative structures, NAMES MATTER. How else would I end up in a discussion where you are borderline advocating for people to change how they role-play their characters based on one person's racial choice?</p><p></p><p>Mask of the Wild doesn't describe a personality trait that the majority of the adventuring party has. It is a poetic name, but it isn't used as a descriptor. Bravery is different. You would think the very fact this conversation is happening might be enough to wonder if the name is poorly chosen for the narrative at the table. After all, if the dragonborn's breath weapon was called "flatulence" then it doesn't matter if the mechanics don't change, the name has made them a joke.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Right, because anti-magic fields are known not to have obvious and clear problems. </p><p></p><p>Hey, have you ever run up a 16 story building in nothing but your bare feet in six seconds? Completely not a supernatural feat, because Monks can do that in an anti-magic field. </p><p></p><p>And obviously curing grievous wounds that were bleeding profusely with a single touch is not supernatural. Paladins can do that in an anti-magic field. </p><p></p><p>Hey, ever get so angry that the ghosts of your ancestors show up and stop arrows from hitting your friends? What a tuesday, completely not a supernatural effect, because barbarians can do that in an anti-magic field. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Right, I just need to be more skilled and do the thing I'm calling out as a problem, because that's the solution to the problem. </p><p></p><p>I mean, I'm sure that after a session of the halfling falling and taking no damage (which everyone else knows they would have taken) and the session before that the halfling being the only one not splashed with mud, the players will be overjoyed that they are able to continue the quest solely because the local magistrate is interested in the halfling. You can't possibly have hurt feelings or feelings of resentment as one player consistently gets special treatment. I mean, it isn't like it is affecting the mechanics after all. And we all know everyone only plays for the mechanics, not the story.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Chaosmancer, post: 8693898, member: 6801228"] Ah wonderful, a mind reader. Always fun to discuss things with them. You know what card I picked up to? How about, instead of telling me what my intent is, you listen to what I say my intent it. Most people haven't even addressed my point, instead explaining the mechanics of the game to me. So yes, people who aren't making arguments in regards to my point aren't getting those arguments seriously addressed. I provided one example, because it was easy to find and post. That doesn't mean it is literally the only example that exists. But I don't feel like trying to track down 50 years of novels and comics to try and lay out every single example. WOW, it is almost like I said that exact same thing, and was talking about that exact thing! Now, can we discuss my actual points about how that can be problematic and how that is a burden on the DM that no other race imposes? Or do you want to do another round of telling me how the lucky mechanics work before telling me that they aren't the narrative, and if you want the narrative then you need to add that in extra? I mean, I've only gone around three times, what's a dozen more. I was showing a narrative example of halfling luck. One that has appeared in multiple media. You are obsessing over the exact example and not seeing it as AN EXAMPLE. Like, honestly, do you think halflings have been depicted as unusually lucky in only a single comic in all of DnD history? And here it is again. If the narrative isn't working, it is the fault of the players and the DM, it can't be that the narrative is flawed. So, my human knight has to be willing to scared of ghosts to show-off how brave the halfling rogue is? Because my roleplaying needs to be dictated by other people's racial choices? As a DM, if the human players aren't acting properly scared, should I tell them that their characters would absolutely be scared by the situation, because they aren't halflings? I believe that you said that was bad to do if I was forcing an elf to aloof, but forcing a human to be scared so the halfling can be brave is fine? Because I don't care about the NPCs, their narrative is completely at my discretion as the DM, but the players are going to be paying attention to the other players. And the halfling can't feel incredibly brave if everyone is incredibly brave. And on the luck, you are literally advocating for the thing I refered to as the problem. Having good fortune befall the halfling while making sure good fortune does not befall the other players. This is a limitation on the DM's narration that only exists when we start talking about halflings. And sure, the halfling finding an extra copper in the road isn't going to ruin the game, but halfling luck is supposed to be consistent, meaning it isn't just going to be one time finding a copper, it is going to be likely something every other gaming session, and eventually, that adds up to special treatment. Which is not something we should be advocating for happening, and can be a problem in the game when it happens. You are literally sitting here, telling me that the solution is to engage in the behavior I'm calling out as a problem. And when you are dealing with narrative structures, NAMES MATTER. How else would I end up in a discussion where you are borderline advocating for people to change how they role-play their characters based on one person's racial choice? Mask of the Wild doesn't describe a personality trait that the majority of the adventuring party has. It is a poetic name, but it isn't used as a descriptor. Bravery is different. You would think the very fact this conversation is happening might be enough to wonder if the name is poorly chosen for the narrative at the table. After all, if the dragonborn's breath weapon was called "flatulence" then it doesn't matter if the mechanics don't change, the name has made them a joke. Right, because anti-magic fields are known not to have obvious and clear problems. Hey, have you ever run up a 16 story building in nothing but your bare feet in six seconds? Completely not a supernatural feat, because Monks can do that in an anti-magic field. And obviously curing grievous wounds that were bleeding profusely with a single touch is not supernatural. Paladins can do that in an anti-magic field. Hey, ever get so angry that the ghosts of your ancestors show up and stop arrows from hitting your friends? What a tuesday, completely not a supernatural effect, because barbarians can do that in an anti-magic field. Right, I just need to be more skilled and do the thing I'm calling out as a problem, because that's the solution to the problem. I mean, I'm sure that after a session of the halfling falling and taking no damage (which everyone else knows they would have taken) and the session before that the halfling being the only one not splashed with mud, the players will be overjoyed that they are able to continue the quest solely because the local magistrate is interested in the halfling. You can't possibly have hurt feelings or feelings of resentment as one player consistently gets special treatment. I mean, it isn't like it is affecting the mechanics after all. And we all know everyone only plays for the mechanics, not the story. [/QUOTE]
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