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RPG Evolution: When Gaming Bleeds
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<blockquote data-quote="Ovinomancer" data-source="post: 7825790" data-attributes="member: 16814"><p>Firstly, let me say that I'm a big fan of D&D -- played since 1e, every edition, and am currently running and loving a 5e campaign -- my fourth in this system.</p><p></p><p>That said, the above really, really, reads like someone that's only ever played D&D, or similar in play games like d20 games. It exposes the usual belief that D&D is actually a broad play experience that does well exploring a wide range of themes. It's not. I love it, but it's not. The things you've posted above as representative of transgressive D&D play are all moustache-twirly and are really just subversions of the very heroic tropes that D&D is built on. In other words, the examples you posted are the same heroic tropes D&D is built on, just reversed. They aren't terribly transgressive because you're not actually immersing into the murder of orphans -- it's played for a lark.</p><p></p><p>Your run-on paragraph then switches topics to the use of the X-card as inherently immersion breaking. It's not. This is like saying that having brakes on your bike distracts from how fast you can ride. The point of the X-card is to provide a brake on play if you go too fast -- it doesn't detract in and of itself. That said, I'll agree to your point with the way it's being strongly presented by some -- as a discussion about play. And I'll also agree that you usually won't need one in a D&D game -- they don't transgress enough. So, here, they don't do anything for immersion at all, as problems that arise aren't going to be because play has gone too far but because a hidden trigger has been found or the players themselves have become toxic. I question the utility of the X-card as a ward against suddenly triggering hidden problems (I think there are better ways), but I see good value in games where play itself is likely to be transgressive in nature (ie, not D&D, even in "evil" mode).</p><p></p><p>However, saying that an X-card is not like a signal in a LARP to halt play is -- odd? I'm not sure what you think the X-card is doing but it's pretty much exactly the same as a hand signal in a LARP to halt play. It's helpful to think of the X-card as a safe word -- something that immediately removes all consent to continue in play. One of the difficulties in this thread is the confusion of what happens next. And that some seem to want to claim all outcomes as good -- no talking, talking, no play, play continues, etc.. </p><p></p><p>Finally, I can't make heads or tales of your last bits.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Ovinomancer, post: 7825790, member: 16814"] Firstly, let me say that I'm a big fan of D&D -- played since 1e, every edition, and am currently running and loving a 5e campaign -- my fourth in this system. That said, the above really, really, reads like someone that's only ever played D&D, or similar in play games like d20 games. It exposes the usual belief that D&D is actually a broad play experience that does well exploring a wide range of themes. It's not. I love it, but it's not. The things you've posted above as representative of transgressive D&D play are all moustache-twirly and are really just subversions of the very heroic tropes that D&D is built on. In other words, the examples you posted are the same heroic tropes D&D is built on, just reversed. They aren't terribly transgressive because you're not actually immersing into the murder of orphans -- it's played for a lark. Your run-on paragraph then switches topics to the use of the X-card as inherently immersion breaking. It's not. This is like saying that having brakes on your bike distracts from how fast you can ride. The point of the X-card is to provide a brake on play if you go too fast -- it doesn't detract in and of itself. That said, I'll agree to your point with the way it's being strongly presented by some -- as a discussion about play. And I'll also agree that you usually won't need one in a D&D game -- they don't transgress enough. So, here, they don't do anything for immersion at all, as problems that arise aren't going to be because play has gone too far but because a hidden trigger has been found or the players themselves have become toxic. I question the utility of the X-card as a ward against suddenly triggering hidden problems (I think there are better ways), but I see good value in games where play itself is likely to be transgressive in nature (ie, not D&D, even in "evil" mode). However, saying that an X-card is not like a signal in a LARP to halt play is -- odd? I'm not sure what you think the X-card is doing but it's pretty much exactly the same as a hand signal in a LARP to halt play. It's helpful to think of the X-card as a safe word -- something that immediately removes all consent to continue in play. One of the difficulties in this thread is the confusion of what happens next. And that some seem to want to claim all outcomes as good -- no talking, talking, no play, play continues, etc.. Finally, I can't make heads or tales of your last bits. [/QUOTE]
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