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<blockquote data-quote="Snarf Zagyg" data-source="post: 8448786" data-attributes="member: 7023840">First, I have no dispute with indie games. If anything, as I am sure you remember, I was incredibly disappointed that we were not able to more fully discuss some of the rules-lite games that I think are fascinating. Moreover, to the extent that I can be, I try to support games and gamers in the independent sphere. What you see from your perspective is not what I see. Second, I do not think that the appropriation of that language (&quot;punching down at marginalized gaming preferences&quot;) in the context of this conversation is appropriate or helpful. There is a great deal of amazing work (some of which is available at the links in the OP) regarding issues of representation and marginalization in the TTRPG community- issue related to gender, sexuality, and minority representation among others. We see these issues both in the indie game community and in the larger, more commercial game community. I do not think that using this language to describe conversations about game preferences (&quot;I like BiTD and 4e and PbTA games&quot; as opposed to &quot;I like Cthulhu Dark and 5e and rule-lite games&quot;) is helpful, and I think it uses language that evokes very real and systemic issues in our society and our hobby in a manner that is unhelpful when describing differences in gaming preferences.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Snarf Zagyg, post: 8448786, member: 7023840"] First, I have no dispute with indie games. If anything, as I am sure you remember, I was incredibly disappointed that we were not able to more fully discuss some of the rules-lite games that I think are fascinating. Moreover, to the extent that I can be, I try to support games and gamers in the independent sphere. What you see from your perspective is not what I see. Second, I do not think that the appropriation of that language ("punching down at marginalized [U]gaming preferences[/U]") in the context of this conversation is appropriate or helpful. There is a great deal of amazing work (some of which is available at the links in the OP) regarding issues of representation and marginalization in the TTRPG community- issue related to gender, sexuality, and minority representation among others. We see these issues both in the indie game community and in the larger, more commercial game community. I do not think that using this language to describe conversations about game preferences ("I like BiTD and 4e and PbTA games" as opposed to "I like Cthulhu Dark and 5e and rule-lite games") is helpful, and I think it uses language that evokes very real and systemic issues in our society and our hobby in a manner that is unhelpful when describing differences in gaming preferences. [/QUOTE]

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