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<blockquote data-quote="Lanefan" data-source="post: 9276580" data-attributes="member: 29398">You could, and that would allow for multiple options which - in this case anyway - exist:You need line of vision AND line of effectYou need line of vision but NOT line of effect (if you can see the target point you're good, even if there's a transparent obstruction in the way)You need line of effect but NOT line of vision (you can cast without seeing or even having a target point as long as there's nothing in the way)You need NEITHER line of effect nor line of vision (you can cast into an unseen space, behind a wall, into the ground, etc.)The third of these is what always causes confusion, in that using &quot;line of sight&quot; terminology incorrectly implies you can't cast most spells while in darkness, or while blinded.My spell write-ups are in most cases long enough already, as I try to incorporate rulings, interactions with other spells, precedents, and so forth established over decades of play. They don't need the extra word count I saved by adding the L component (which is defined once, along with V, S, and M, in a separate 'introduction to spells' page). <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile&nbsp; &nbsp; :)"&nbsp; data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /></blockquote>

[QUOTE="Lanefan, post: 9276580, member: 29398"] You could, and that would allow for multiple options which - in this case anyway - exist: You need line of vision AND line of effect You need line of vision but NOT line of effect (if you can see the target point you're good, even if there's a transparent obstruction in the way) You need line of effect but NOT line of vision (you can cast without seeing or even having a target point as long as there's nothing in the way) You need NEITHER line of effect nor line of vision (you can cast into an unseen space, behind a wall, into the ground, etc.) The third of these is what always causes confusion, in that using "line of sight" terminology incorrectly implies you can't cast most spells while in darkness, or while blinded. My spell write-ups are in most cases long enough already, as I try to incorporate rulings, interactions with other spells, precedents, and so forth established over decades of play. They don't need the extra word count I saved by adding the L component (which is defined once, along with V, S, and M, in a separate 'introduction to spells' page). :) [/QUOTE]

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