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<blockquote data-quote="I'm A Banana" data-source="post: 6458965" data-attributes="member: 2067">Personally, I imagine everything needs a strong story hook...but I was mostly talking about mechanical distinction.And if &quot;versatility&quot; is the mechanical attraction, again, I'm pointed at a wizard subclass. Give it a feature that makes them a little more durable and a little more skill-y, with some access to others' spell lists, and you've got a flexible, versatile caster. But this is also why there's a lot of overlap with the bard (jack-of-all trades indeed!) and the cleric (the original gish). I don't think we'll see a class that can make items out of the DMG without negotiation with the DM. Magic items in 5e aren't designed to be readily accessible and convenient like they were in 3e. They're not really supposed to be easy or reliable.That said, Eberron has easy and reliable magic (5e's default actually makes the setting MORE distinct in this respect), and I do think there's room for a class whose class features take the form of items that are unique to that class (rather than being the same items as the DMG contains). You don't learn cantrips, you build wands. You don't cast spells, you scribe scrolls and brew potions. You don't make extra attacks, you make swords of swiftness. The challenge there is making this more than cosmetic. If you've got a character who can build a wand that casts mending, and it works mechanically exactly like casting the cantrip mending except instead of Verbal, Somatic, and Material components, you just need your wand...that's not strongly distinct, and points to subclass territory again. I imagine it's possible to have that, but it'd be something that artificers haven't had before. Which might make them too different from what had come before...</blockquote>

[QUOTE="I'm A Banana, post: 6458965, member: 2067"] Personally, I imagine [I]everything[/I] needs a strong story hook...but I was mostly talking about mechanical distinction. And if "versatility" is the mechanical attraction, again, I'm pointed at a wizard subclass. Give it a feature that makes them a little more durable and a little more skill-y, with some access to others' spell lists, and you've got a flexible, versatile caster. But this is also why there's a lot of overlap with the bard (jack-of-all trades indeed!) and the cleric (the original gish). I don't think we'll see a class that can make items out of the DMG without negotiation with the DM. Magic items in 5e aren't designed to be readily accessible and convenient like they were in 3e. They're not really supposed to be easy or reliable. That said, Eberron has easy and reliable magic (5e's default actually makes the setting MORE distinct in this respect), and I do think there's room for a class whose [I]class features[/I] take the form of items that are unique to that class (rather than being the same items as the DMG contains). You don't learn cantrips, you build wands. You don't cast spells, you scribe scrolls and brew potions. You don't make extra attacks, you make [I]swords of swiftness[/I]. The challenge there is making this more than cosmetic. If you've got a character who can build a wand that casts [I]mending[/I], and it works mechanically exactly like casting the cantrip [I]mending[/I] except instead of Verbal, Somatic, and Material components, you just need your wand...that's not strongly distinct, and points to subclass territory again. I imagine it's possible to have that, but it'd be something that artificers haven't had before. Which might make them too different from what had come before... [/QUOTE]

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