Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
White Dwarf Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Nest
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
EN Publishing
Twitter
BlueSky
Facebook
Instagram
EN World
BlueSky
YouTube
Facebook
Twitter
Twitch
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*TTRPGs General
Ryan Dancey - D&D in a Death Spiral
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="eyebeams" data-source="post: 5326792" data-attributes="member: 9225"><p>Many of these symptoms were actually there by 3.5. Basically, WotC avoided the so-called "supplement treadmill" for perhaps 3 years (and given how line management works this was probably contemplated as early as 2002). The company dropped brown softcovers pretty damned quick and eventually took over the niches they'd left to third party publishers. </p><p></p><p>I remember hilarious complaints from WotC staff that publishers weren't using the OGL properly. Good companies apparently should have just done D&D adventures and settings that were PHB-centric, and were Bad for wanting to nurture independent identities. That tells you how well management thought the OGL was helping D&D sales.</p><p></p><p>DDI follows the pattern of promising more than the company can deliver on the electronic front, but we're talking about a project that was struck by some disasters (such as a murder-suicide) that can't be blamed on a poor strategy. Estimates based purely on salary aren't going to work because the IT infrastructure costs money too.</p><p></p><p>The truth is probably that the ideal of an evergreen set of core rules is foolish to pursue and fails to deal with the hobby games market's nature, and this was true even when 3e was launched -- it was just disguised by the fact that an overhaul of D&D was long overdue. Yes, greying geeks like the idea of an edition that will last forever, but a winning business model is more like to resemble WH40K's, with a regular cycle of iterative updates (which is better for us greying types since we can kludge things when the rules are very similar). Perhaps Essentials reflects this awareness, though it is a confusing execution.</p><p></p><p>So I would say that yes, sales are declining. I would also say that this was probably par for the course for 3e, too, because "reprint the PHB forever" was a failed plan in all incarnations.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="eyebeams, post: 5326792, member: 9225"] Many of these symptoms were actually there by 3.5. Basically, WotC avoided the so-called "supplement treadmill" for perhaps 3 years (and given how line management works this was probably contemplated as early as 2002). The company dropped brown softcovers pretty damned quick and eventually took over the niches they'd left to third party publishers. I remember hilarious complaints from WotC staff that publishers weren't using the OGL properly. Good companies apparently should have just done D&D adventures and settings that were PHB-centric, and were Bad for wanting to nurture independent identities. That tells you how well management thought the OGL was helping D&D sales. DDI follows the pattern of promising more than the company can deliver on the electronic front, but we're talking about a project that was struck by some disasters (such as a murder-suicide) that can't be blamed on a poor strategy. Estimates based purely on salary aren't going to work because the IT infrastructure costs money too. The truth is probably that the ideal of an evergreen set of core rules is foolish to pursue and fails to deal with the hobby games market's nature, and this was true even when 3e was launched -- it was just disguised by the fact that an overhaul of D&D was long overdue. Yes, greying geeks like the idea of an edition that will last forever, but a winning business model is more like to resemble WH40K's, with a regular cycle of iterative updates (which is better for us greying types since we can kludge things when the rules are very similar). Perhaps Essentials reflects this awareness, though it is a confusing execution. So I would say that yes, sales are declining. I would also say that this was probably par for the course for 3e, too, because "reprint the PHB forever" was a failed plan in all incarnations. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*TTRPGs General
Ryan Dancey - D&D in a Death Spiral
Top