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Message: <blockquote data-quote="DND_Reborn" data-source="post: 7576871" data-attributes="member: 6987520">While I think it would be great to have precise text in the PHB to support either position, IME so far the text is simply not there. If it was, people would have been using it by now.Even if someone finds text they believe supports their position well, 9 times out of 10 the wording is likely ambiguous enough to still allow for different interpretations. Often this was done purposefully to allow the tables to run as they wanted to make the game the most fun for them, other times it was honest mistakes or oversights which are addressed in errata.Resorting to other sources such as SA is fine, but even that is taken with a grain of salt by many and official only in the loosest of terms.It is ironic that a couple days ago when we began our last session and a player was making his Paladin/Rogue, I brought up the text of Shield Master and of the other two players (I'd already discussed it at length with our DM), one felt the shove had to come at the end, the other believed you could do it at the beginning if you wanted to (but then you had to use the Attack action afterwards, no other actions were permissible).Isn't that funny? Two uninformed opinions in our group and one chooses the attack then shove and the other the shove when you want but must attack at some point?When I told them about this thread and we had our discussion, we compromised on the attack, shove, and maybe more attacks if you have them model.Sorry about wandering a bit, but my point is that since the text we have available isn't definitive unless you choose to follow SA and JC's ruling, this thread will never end...Maybe that is the point, though, huh? <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /></blockquote>

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