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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Cadfan" data-source="post: 4262459" data-attributes="member: 40961">outsider- I agree, sort of.  There's really no reason to go Wizard then multiclass into something else.  The old 3e reason was to gain an at will power- a basic attack.  But now you've got that already.But I do think there are reasons to make a more martial wizard in terms of defense, and to wade into close range combat.  A staff wizard with some Close spells might want leather armor and toughness.And there are reasons for a non wizard to try to get some wizard powers.  For example, a Warlord might do well by dropping his shield in favor of a wand in his off hand, and multiclassing into Wizard.  He'd already have the Int score, and he could focus on moving his allies around the field of battle so as to maximize the effectiveness of his area attacks.But I do agree that a gish, by which i mean "fully competent as a wizard, and can also fight in melee if he wants" has no reason to exist.  At its core its not a balanced concept, because it doesn't give up anything for that diversity of power, and in any case there's no advantage to going into melee if you could just pick an at will Close power instead.</blockquote>