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<blockquote data-quote="LostSoul" data-source="post: 4508877" data-attributes="member: 386">They just went right in; they made some good knowledge checks about Thunderspire and the Mages of Saruun (which got fed back into the backstory of one of the PCs - Malchior the Warlord, multiclassed Wizard, who has friends and an uncle in the organization).I am thinking about putting the Invulnerable Coat of Arnd in there, maybe on Paldamar, as an heirloom of Malchior's noble family.&nbsp; I'll re-fluff it, or Arnd.So, to answer the question: how difficult should it be to get in?&nbsp; I think it depends on how much time you want to spend on it.If it's a big deal to you and your group then I'd make it a full adventure, maybe a session or two.&nbsp; The adventure needs to end with the PCs finding the entrance to Thunderspire, so make that easy to discover.&nbsp; However, I'd make the adventure resolve some other kind of issue, or bring in a complication.What I'm thinking is that the adventure takes place in your minotaur PC's father's tomb.&nbsp; Maybe it's been defiled by Vecna, keeper of secrets.&nbsp; Maybe the PC's father switched to worship of Vecna in his final days in order to discover the entrance, but the twisted lies of Vecna meant that he died once he discovered the secret.&nbsp; Now he's a ghost, angry and bitter.The adventure resolves that - will the PCs be able to end Vecna's curse on him, or will he still be obsessed with finding Thunderspire?&nbsp; Either way he will tell the PCs where it is.I'm thinking a cool intelligent magic item, maybe artifact-level, that holds his soul will guide the PCs into Thunderspire.&nbsp; +2 to Dungeoneering checks sounds like a good bonus.If it's not that big a deal, a skill challenge would be a good way to approach it.&nbsp; I'd probably just copy the Moria scene; the PCs will eventually break through, but will they be able to get in before that lurker in the water attacks them?&nbsp; Will it break the entrance so that no one can get in or out that way?Whatever you do, don't make it easy to get in.&nbsp; Even if the PCs just get really lucky it's better than if they do something simple to get access.&nbsp; If you make it too easy, the PC's father is going to look like an idiot, and that means that the PC's own image will be tarnished.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="LostSoul, post: 4508877, member: 386"] They just went right in; they made some good knowledge checks about Thunderspire and the Mages of Saruun (which got fed back into the backstory of one of the PCs - Malchior the Warlord, multiclassed Wizard, who has friends and an uncle in the organization). I am thinking about putting the Invulnerable Coat of Arnd in there, maybe on Paldamar, as an heirloom of Malchior's noble family. I'll re-fluff it, or Arnd. So, to answer the question: how difficult should it be to get in? I think it depends on how much time you want to spend on it. If it's a big deal to you and your group then I'd make it a full adventure, maybe a session or two. The adventure needs to end with the PCs finding the entrance to Thunderspire, so make that easy to discover. However, I'd make the adventure resolve some other kind of issue, or bring in a complication. What I'm thinking is that the adventure takes place in your minotaur PC's father's tomb. Maybe it's been defiled by Vecna, keeper of secrets. Maybe the PC's father switched to worship of Vecna in his final days in order to discover the entrance, but the twisted lies of Vecna meant that he died once he discovered the secret. Now he's a ghost, angry and bitter. The adventure resolves that - will the PCs be able to end Vecna's curse on him, or will he still be obsessed with finding Thunderspire? Either way he will tell the PCs where it is. I'm thinking a cool intelligent magic item, maybe artifact-level, that holds his soul will guide the PCs into Thunderspire. +2 to Dungeoneering checks sounds like a good bonus. If it's not that big a deal, a skill challenge would be a good way to approach it. I'd probably just copy the Moria scene; the PCs will eventually break through, but will they be able to get in before that lurker in the water attacks them? Will it break the entrance so that no one can get in or out that way? Whatever you do, don't make it easy to get in. Even if the PCs just get really lucky it's better than if they do something simple to get access. If you make it too easy, the PC's father is going to look like an idiot, and that means that the PC's own image will be tarnished. [/QUOTE]

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