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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Victim" data-source="post: 729921" data-attributes="member: 78">DMG 176.  Clothing, jewerly and armor resize.At higher levels, the loss of HD, extra costs for magic armor, and loss of feats lose significance.If, at level 6, things are about even in combat between a LA +2 Half Ogre and human fighter, then what about at level 10?  Or 15?The penalties from the race lose signficance over time.  For example, at level 10:Item selections: (49k)+2 weapon (8)+3 Full Plate (10)+3 Shield (9)+3 Cloak of Resistance (9)Amulet of Health +2 (4)Gauntlets of Ogre Power +2 (4)5000 gp for spending money, gear, non combat items, potionsThis isn't exactly an optimal equipment selection, but both characters will generally have the same equipment.  The only item that the Half Ogre can't use that the human could is an Amulet of Natural Armor.Stats before items and racial adjustments:STR 15DEX 13CON 14INT 10WIS 12CHA 8A simple standard array.Level 10 human fighter:STR 18DEX 13CON 17INT 10WIS 12CHA 8Spd: 20Ini: +5Att: +10/+5+17/+12Dmg: 1d10+8 17-20x2AC: 27 HP: 10d10+30 (Max: 130, LG: 94)F: +13R: +7W: +9Feats: 11:  Exotic Weapon, Focus, Specialization, Imp Crit: Bastard sword, Dodge, Iron Will, Power Attack, Cleave, Imp. Initiative, Blindfight, Mobility39 skillpoints, but from the largely worthless fighter list.------------------------------------------Half Ogre Fighter 8STR 24DEX 11CON 19INT 8WIS 12CHA 6 SPd 20INI +4Att: +8/+3+17/+12 (+8 base, +7 STR, +2 weapon, +1 feat, -1 size)Dmg: 2d6+11 17-20x2AC: 29 (+11 armor, +5 shield, +4 natural, -1 size)HP: 8d10+36 (Max: 116, LG: 88)F: +13R: +5W: +6Feats: 8: Focus, Specialization, Imp Crit: Greatsword, Iron Will, Power Attack, Cleave, Improved Initiative, Blindfight8 Skillpoints---------------------------------------------Normal combat, starting from 5ft away:Human +17/+12 - needs a 12 and 17 to hitOgre +17/+12  - needs a 11 and 16 to hit, counting dodgeUsing Max HP and discounting crits:The human needs about 8.5 hits to drop the ogre.The ogre needs about 7.2 hits to drop the human.Using Living Greyhawk HP:The human needs about 6.5 hits to drop the ogre.The ogre needs about 5.2 hits to drop the human.Gee, and the ogre hits more often too.  Crits would speed up and randomize the process, but since both guys have the same crit range, wouldn't alter the average outcome.Comparing Grapple checks, the human has +14, and the half ogre has +19.  The difference here is rather considerable.  The human has the advantage on saves, but only by a little.  The half ogres immunity to person affecting spells should provide a counterbalance for the weaker will save.The main drawback is the extreme lack of skill points for the Half Ogre.  Of course, if we use a Half Orc instead of human base character, the Half Ogre is only short 2 skill points and still has significant combat advantages.  And then there's reach.If, at +2 LA, the Half Ogre has advantages over the Half Orc in pure combat ability, then at +1 LA, there's clearly something wrong.  Half Orcs are the core race for pure butt-kicking, monster slaying action.  Half Ogres shouldn't be able to out damage them and have reach too.</blockquote>

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