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<blockquote data-quote="PapersAndPaychecks" data-source="post: 3456635" data-attributes="member: 28854">Here's a puzzle.&nbsp; To solve it, you have to figure out the answer.&nbsp; If you can't figure out the answer, you have to go a different way.Puzzles are absolutely fine, provided they don't block the characters' progress.&nbsp; You solve a puzzle, then you get a reward, but you can complete the adventure/save the damsel in distress/prevent the Evil Wizard from Blowing Up The World/stop the Mad Cultists from Summoning the Elder Horror or whatever else without solving the puzzles.Puzzles are only a problem if the players can't solve the puzzle and can't progress without solving it, see?&nbsp; But to a certain extent, with any reasonably challenging puzzle, yes, you do have to figure out what the DM's thinking.&nbsp; And because this is a game rather than a classroom and the DM isn't a teacher, the DM has no responsibility to make sure the players can reach every single reward and attain every single goal.&nbsp; Success is only sweet if there's a real possibility of failure.So I think reasonably challenging puzzles are a feature of good games of D&amp;D, provided they're mixed with tactical combat challenges, roleplaying challenges and other obstacles in an interesting and coherent way.It does help to have players who make a reasonable attempt to solve the puzzle rather than just snivelling at the DM until he gets so bored of their complaints that he just makes everything so easy the players can't fail.&nbsp; There are far too many players in the latter category, imo.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="PapersAndPaychecks, post: 3456635, member: 28854"] Here's a puzzle. To solve it, you have to figure out the answer. If you can't figure out the answer, you have to go a different way. Puzzles are absolutely fine, provided they don't block the characters' progress. You solve a puzzle, then you get a reward, but you can complete the adventure/save the damsel in distress/prevent the Evil Wizard from Blowing Up The World/stop the Mad Cultists from Summoning the Elder Horror or whatever else without solving the puzzles. Puzzles are only a problem if the players can't solve the puzzle and can't progress without solving it, see? But to a certain extent, with any reasonably challenging puzzle, yes, you do have to figure out what the DM's thinking. And because this is a game rather than a classroom and the DM isn't a teacher, the DM has no responsibility to make sure the players can reach every single reward and attain every single goal. Success is only sweet if there's a real possibility of failure. So I think reasonably challenging puzzles are a feature of good games of D&D, provided they're mixed with tactical combat challenges, roleplaying challenges and other obstacles in an interesting and coherent way. It does help to have players who make a reasonable attempt to solve the puzzle rather than just snivelling at the DM until he gets so bored of their complaints that he just makes everything so easy the players can't fail. There are far too many players in the latter category, imo. [/QUOTE]

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