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<blockquote data-quote="Tony Vargas" data-source="post: 6762009" data-attributes="member: 996">Remember that saving every round was a 3.5 innovation, and prior to that there were /lots/ of save-or-die or save-or-boring-for-the-whole-combat (or longer) effects flying around, and you just had to make it through to high enough level that you virtually always made those saves.&nbsp; 5e takes that innovation much further than 3.5 did, so just imagine what it'd be like if it hadn't.&nbsp; You wouldn't just sit out a round or two of a three-round combat with your 8th-level character, the character would be instantly killed, or sit out the next 3-18 10-minute 'turns' or something.Sorry if that's a little grognardly 'kids these days don't know how good they got it.'&nbsp; ;(That's just going to double-down on the issue, yes.&nbsp; One solution is to give everyone better saves.&nbsp; Giving classes more proficient saves, or giving non-proficient saves a +0 to +4 bonus over 20 levels instead of +2 to +6, for instance.&nbsp; You could also give save re-rolls and/or save bonuses if an ally does something to help you 'snap out of it.'&nbsp; And/or you could dial down what various effects do.&nbsp; Instead of paralyzing, just being unable to take a move that turn, for instance.&nbsp; Limit options instead of just doing nothing.&nbsp; Another sort of goofy indie-style option is to have a dead or out of the fight PC 'fight in spirit,' and give him something to do - like hand out a bonus or advantage or a re-roll or whatever, either mystically or via a flash-back scene or whatever strikes everyone as interesting.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Tony Vargas, post: 6762009, member: 996"] Remember that saving every round was a 3.5 innovation, and prior to that there were /lots/ of save-or-die or save-or-boring-for-the-whole-combat (or longer) effects flying around, and you just had to make it through to high enough level that you virtually always made those saves. 5e takes that innovation much further than 3.5 did, so just imagine what it'd be like if it hadn't. You wouldn't just sit out a round or two of a three-round combat with your 8th-level character, the character would be instantly killed, or sit out the next 3-18 10-minute 'turns' or something. Sorry if that's a little grognardly 'kids these days don't know how good they got it.' ;( That's just going to double-down on the issue, yes. One solution is to give everyone better saves. Giving classes more proficient saves, or giving non-proficient saves a +0 to +4 bonus over 20 levels instead of +2 to +6, for instance. You could also give save re-rolls and/or save bonuses if an ally does something to help you 'snap out of it.' And/or you could dial down what various effects do. Instead of paralyzing, just being unable to take a move that turn, for instance. Limit options instead of just doing nothing. Another sort of goofy indie-style option is to have a dead or out of the fight PC 'fight in spirit,' and give him something to do - like hand out a bonus or advantage or a re-roll or whatever, either mystically or via a flash-back scene or whatever strikes everyone as interesting. [/QUOTE]

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