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<blockquote data-quote="Tony Vargas" data-source="post: 7824002" data-attributes="member: 996">It was even over in 3.5:&nbsp; the Bard was Tier 3, that's a solid, respectable, balanced class, and clearly superior to the Tier 5 fighter, just in a game with Tier 1 Wizards and CoDzilla.&nbsp; Completely over in 4e, when the Bard was neatly balanced with the other leaders, like the Cleric and Warlord.But, yeah, the 5e Bard has continued to move up in the world, and is very plausibly the best of the Tier 2 casters, if not honorary Tier 1, in spite of being spontaneous rather than neo-Vancian.And that somehow requires spellcasting and a lute?Those are closely related, yes.&nbsp; Mearls coined the Three Pillars in the runup to the Next playtest, and actually applying them to design would mean there can be no 'face' holding down the whole social pillar, and no niche-protected thief or ranger doing the whole exploration thing in the dungeon or wilderness, respectively.&nbsp; 5e's not as all-in on that as it could be, but the Bard certainly doesn't rest it's existence on being Party Face - not with 9 levels of spells on tap.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Tony Vargas, post: 7824002, member: 996"] It was even over in 3.5: the Bard was Tier 3, that's a solid, respectable, balanced class, and [I]clearly superior to the Tier 5 fighter,[/I] just in a game with Tier 1 Wizards and CoDzilla. Completely over in 4e, when the Bard was neatly balanced with the other leaders, like the Cleric and Warlord. But, yeah, the 5e Bard has continued to move up in the world, and is very plausibly the best of the Tier 2 casters, if not honorary Tier 1, in spite of being spontaneous rather than neo-Vancian. And that somehow [I]requires[/I] spellcasting and a lute? Those are closely related, yes. Mearls coined the Three Pillars in the runup to the Next playtest, and actually applying them to design would mean there can be no 'face' holding down the whole social pillar, and no niche-protected thief or ranger doing the whole exploration thing in the dungeon or wilderness, respectively. 5e's not as all-in on that as it could be, but the Bard certainly doesn't rest it's existence on being Party Face - not with 9 levels of spells on tap. [/QUOTE]

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