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<blockquote data-quote="EzekielRaiden" data-source="post: 8730289" data-attributes="member: 6790260">Casters almost always have a choice, and will almost always attempt to use weak saves, so no, I don't feel at all like that's an incorrect thing to account for.And what I'm saying is, that &quot;3 consecutive times&quot; thing happens 12.5% of the time for true 50/50 saves. It happens over 42% of the time for 75/25 saves. That means it would be more than 3x the frequency (3 and 3/8ths to be exact.)Conversely, granting save bonuses is very much more a player-facing thing in 4e, while bonuses on both sides can vary wildly in 5e, from craptastic negative modifiers and no proficiency to beyond-mortal-limits modifiers and +6 proficiency (I don't believe anything gets expertise in saving throws), on top of the variability in the target numbers. Which even further cements the difference here.So no. I don't think it's at all inaccurate to say they are so starkly different. Much as Hit Dice and Healing Surges.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="EzekielRaiden, post: 8730289, member: 6790260"] Casters almost always have a choice, and will almost always attempt to use weak saves, so no, I don't feel at all like that's an incorrect thing to account for. And what I'm saying is, that "3 consecutive times" thing happens 12.5% of the time for true 50/50 saves. It happens over 42% of the time for 75/25 saves. That means it would be [I]more[/I] than 3x the frequency (3 and 3/8ths to be exact.) Conversely, granting save bonuses is very much more a player-facing thing in 4e, while bonuses on both sides can vary wildly in 5e, from craptastic negative modifiers and no proficiency to beyond-mortal-limits modifiers and +6 proficiency (I don't believe anything gets expertise in saving throws), on top of the variability in the target numbers. Which even further cements the difference here. So no. I don't think it's at all inaccurate to say they are so starkly different. Much as Hit Dice and Healing Surges. [/QUOTE]

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